Spider-Noir Episode 7 Review

[00:00:00] This is The Defenders on TV Podcast Industries. We're back with Spider-Noir Episode 7, Nobody's Hero. Well, she ain't loved me. That's okay. Nobody has to love anybody but to go behind my back like that with a doctor. What the hell was that? That's worse than a betrayal that's adding insult to injury.

[00:00:27] But, Eamon, I digress because right here in the palm of my hand I hold the antidote. Yeah, well, you ain't the first one to figure that one out, pal. It's kind of how we stay in business. Keep them coming, Eamon.

[00:01:11] Welcome back, fellow Defenders, to TV Podcast Industries. We are here with the penultimate episode of Spider-Noir Episode 7, Nobody's Hero. I am one of your hosts, Derek. Hello there, fellow Defenders. I am your other host, John. Welcome back to the podcast and, of course, to Episode 7 of Spider-Noir, Nobody's Hero. Great to be back.

[00:01:34] If you are just joining us for whatever reason, please head on over to our website at tvpodcastindustries.com where you can join to any thwipping or thwopping podcast catcher of your choice. I'm hoping the reason you're joining us is because you enjoy our coverage of Spider-Noir. We also love to get your thoughts in on all our episodes of Spider-Noir. Please send them in to feedback at tvpodcastindustries.com

[00:02:03] or, equally, you can head on over to our Facebook group at facebook.com forward slash groups forward slash TV Podcast Industries where you can leave your thoughts, theories, observations on any of the spoiler comments that we leave there. We're also over on Discord and the link for that will be in the show notes here. Yeah. But let us get on with our spoiler-filled discussion of Spider-Noir Episode 7.

[00:02:32] Yeah, absolutely. It is roasting in dilden and even hotter in the podcast room, so I suspect we're going to have some very quick points about Spider-Noir before we go on fire in the room that we're sitting in to record today. So thanks very much for joining us for this one. The showrunner for this show, as we mentioned before, of course, is Orin Uziel. Well, this episode was written by Bruce Marshall-Romans. He's an executive producer on the show and also wrote on The Punisher show for Netflix, delivering Season 1, Episode 7 and the Season 2 finale.

[00:03:00] The Season 2 finale, I remember giving some pretty low marks for that season of The Punisher, but mostly just because of their dedication to Stan Lee directly after The Punisher slaughtered lots of people, which I just thought was a bit tactless. That was the only particular reason. I don't think that was specifically written by Bruce-Romans, and he certainly delivers something better here than that finale, anyway. The episode was directed by Greg Utenis. He's an Emmy and Golden Globe winning director on big and small projects,

[00:03:29] including one of John's favourites. He directed an episode of Snowfall, and he directed three episodes of House of the Dragon Season 1, including that epic finale for Season 1. So kind of cool to have someone that's worked in those absolutely huge shows like House of the Dragon and some smaller shows like Snowfall here as director on Spider-Noir. Yes, absolutely. All good stuff there. Great to see someone coming over from Snowfall as well. Yeah, really interesting.

[00:03:59] Could do with a bit of that now with the temperatures rocketing over 25 degrees here. Although that Snowfall is a bit, well, coke rather than cold weather. But yes, we'd love some Snowfall. But John, do you want to tell us what they gave us with your synopsis for Spider-Noir? Episode 7, Nobody's Hero. Sure. Silvermane is ready to take his fight with Mayor Morris to the streets. He instructs Megawatt and Flint Marco to attack Morris' campaign office and steal his money,

[00:04:25] as Lonnie retrieves Silvermane's confiscated booze from the police. In an early house in the city, Ben Reilly drowns his sorrows over Cat's betrayal and beats up a group of dock workers who criticise the ageing spider. After some encouragement from Robbie to help the other metahumans, Ben prepares doses for the antidote to cure all of them and plans to use it on himself afterwards. As the spider struggles against Lonnie Lincoln

[00:04:52] and the corrupt police officers due to a previous overuse of his webbing at the bar fight, Robbie manages to inject the cure into Lonnie Lincoln through his eye and the two help him evade the police officers. While Ben recovers from the fight, Lincoln thanks the two for helping him, encourages Robbie to find another way to report outside of the Daily Bugle and leaves the city with his mother. Both Silvermane and Morris find out that Tombstone has been cured.

[00:05:21] They each give orders to bring Ben to them so they can contact the spider. I really loved how that ended with the very comic book looking moment with both sides being told they need to find the spider. I thought that was a very cool ending for this episode. But let's start at the beginning of our web shots with our web shot number one. Yes, Silvermane's Marauders.

[00:05:49] Here we have go out and fight for, you know, let's retake back this town. Let's destroy the threat to my empire, which is Mayor Morris. And effectively, Silvermane sends off Clint Marco and Dirk Layden to attack the mayor's campaign office.

[00:06:15] That's not before he's given Cat Hardy a little bit of advice around, you know, why he does what he does ultimately. Yeah, Cat's kind of questioning why he would still send his men off and fight against Mayor Morris. Just an interesting discussion that they have about, you know, like he gets the best food, he has the best club in town, he gets her to get the best whiskey for him,

[00:06:41] even though he hasn't got any of the booze because it was all confiscated by the mayor. And she's kind of asking him, like, why do you do this? You've got everything. You've got the best of everything in a time when everybody else is going through depression. And he says, well, the fight is what makes the whiskey taste good. That's why I do it. Everything is made better by the fact that I have to fight for it, given where I come from. As you say, yeah, like you say, fighting is the point.

[00:07:07] He goes, go forth and maraud, mischief and mayhem. Show the mayor who is boss. Yeah, I mean, it's really good. I mean, Silverman's great in this opener with Cat because there's some great little one-liners. I think one of them is, does the king ride his sister when asked for a second glass of whiskey? Absolutely. That's what he says to Cat. I think my favorite, and I kind of feel it today in the 90 degree temperature that's in this room

[00:07:37] where he says, I'm so thirsty, my throat is drier than a camel's hole in a sandstorm, which is fantastic. Really like that. And yes, another part of our whiskey watch. But I think at this stage in episode seven of Spider-Man and War, we can probably retire our whiskey watch because whiskey is in almost every single scene of the episode. Yes. And anything to do with Silvermane soon comes around to Greenspot, which is kind of interesting. Yeah.

[00:08:03] I think the other thing that happens here as well before he sends them off to maraud is that there's a little bit of introspection around having come from Dr. Favre's lab, which was destroyed. Because you also see Cat here trying to get a kind of a hook on actually what's maybe transpired there without seeming obvious. Yeah.

[00:08:28] And you do have Flint and Lonnie saying, you know, there were friends and comrades to Silvermane saying it was like meat in big jars. The doctor was just with bodies. No live supers. It was, you know, making freets in her basement. It was an abomination in my view, says Silvermane, hence why it was burned to the ground. And Dirk kind of repeats, you know, to the ground.

[00:08:57] And it feels like that's the, you know, this kind of nice little fissure between Lonnie and Flint where they're saying these were our friends and comrades. And even just the, you know, Flint trying to stay the hand of Dirk in terms of killing Freckles or at least electrocuting him in the previous episode. Whereas here, Dirk doesn't really have that emotional tie. He doesn't call them friends or comrades.

[00:09:24] He's just, you know, he sees it as this tragic stage play in a sense and just repeats Silverman's burn to the ground. And I think that's a little hint at the difference between him and Flint and Lonnie. Yeah, absolutely. Which I think is quite interesting. Yeah, and I really like Cass as well, her reaction to it going, hang on a second, you burnt the place to the ground with everything that was inside it.

[00:09:50] Now, we know that she was concerned potentially for the spider, for Ben, that he could have been there because she had those flashbacks. So she was thinking through all the conversations that she had with Ben and the fact that she handed over Ben to the doctor, effectively. But the way that she says it where Silverman's like, and what would you care about that? And she goes, well, oh, yeah, of course, I'm just a pretty little singer who doesn't take care of anything and doesn't mind anything. That's all I'm here to do is sing. And he goes, I wish you were.

[00:10:20] So, again, Cat pushing back from the position that Silverman keeps wanting to put her into just as the club owner and singer in his club who keeps her mouth shut and doesn't do anything and doesn't challenge anything that he says or does. So I like that there's, again, those conversations between them as well.

[00:10:39] But, yeah, just to crack on a little bit more with the Marauders as Sandman and Megawatt go down to the mayor's campaign office, it does show, again, that deeper fissure that you're talking about between Flint Marco and Dirk Layden where Dirk, as Megawatt, seems to want to abuse and beat everyone around them and kill everyone around them. Flint is like, we are here on a mission. Our mission is to take out all of the mayor's financing. And they do.

[00:11:07] They take every single penny from the campaign office. And as you hear in the background throughout the rest of the episode, they redistribute it to the people of New York, literally throwing it out on street corners saying, elect the new mayor, Hudson. I think the other two things I kind of like about this, we have classic swag bags being deployed to take the notes. Put Batman 66 in there. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:11:34] And we have the classic line, Silvermane sends his regards. Oh, yes. As they kind of leave the campaign headquarters and the people with all the money. Yeah. You know, so I thought this was really good. I like the fact a little bit later we see Morris going after the chief of police for this absolute horrendous crime, whereas the chief is kind of washing his hands as well.

[00:12:00] If the spider is your mate, it's probably a good time to call him. Absolutely. You know, so, you know, this has real implications playing out. And I think it's a nice little moment here seeing them come into the election office. Yeah, absolutely. We'll talk about this other bit a little bit later on. But just wanted to mention in the sending out of the Marauders, I like that he sent Sandman a Megawatt to go to the mayor's campaign office and also sent Lonnie out to get the booze back.

[00:12:28] So there's a plan for each of the three members of his super team. One to take all the money and the other one to take the slight away, get all of his booze back in his hands. So, yeah. Speaking of booze, let's get on to web shop number two. Ah, Boozy Ben Barberall, I think would be the title for the second one, wouldn't it? Absolutely.

[00:12:53] I like this kind of, you know, seeing the urgency around Silvermane's Marauders and Silvermane and kind of feeling that they're on the crest of a wave. We have Boozy Ben feeling very much down on his luck, wallowing in the betrayal from Kat after getting out of Faber's lab. But equally with everything that was done to him, you know, having to deal with that.

[00:13:22] So he's getting himself nicely drowned in his sorrows at this early house in the dockyard. But it's good that it's returned here because this was the place they used in the first episode where we saw Ben Riley first drowning his sorrows. Now here he is after going through everything that he was going to go through to fly away to another place with his new girlfriend, Kat. Everything has now turned back on its head. He's right back where he was.

[00:13:48] And this is all following on where we had Kat visiting Janet saying that she hadn't seen Ben for days. And Janet kind of going, hang on a second. I thought everything was OK. I love a teeny touch of that scene where Janet has worked out just from the posture of Kat and just from the attitude of Kat. She's worked out that actually something really bad has happened to Ben because there's no way that Kat would be coming to her if she thought he'd actually.

[00:14:14] And she calls Robbie immediately after Kat has left as well for his help. Yeah, no, I mean, it's a really good sort of connection here with with Kat and Janet. Like there's some really good lines here, like with with Kat arriving at the office. Janet says, you took my boss and my business. What do you what did you forget? And but increasingly becomes suspicious about her questioning around where is Ben Riley?

[00:14:42] Because, you know, she cottons on very quickly because, well, actually, he gave me money and he wouldn't do that if he hadn't actually decided to go along with it. Because he's very precious around his money. And she's like, who is it? Silvermane?

[00:14:56] And then back in the bar, you know, Dan on his look.

[00:15:20] Look, you have this nice little moment between Ben and the barman, Eamon, where he says, I hold in my hand the antidote of all my problems. And of course, the barman thinks that he's talking about the booze and says that's what keeps us in business. But in fact, it's the antidote, which, you know, he hasn't yet taken.

[00:15:44] And so and then you get this group enter entering this loads of dockers and workers who've just finished up their shift. Yeah. But then start giving out about the spider, almost compounding everything that's going on for Ben here. He's being, you know, he's wallowing around cats. He's literally just been forcibly operated on. Yeah, actually. He's lost his liver, isn't it? Yeah.

[00:16:12] And then all these dockers come in effectively giving out about him whilst also rejoicing in the fact they've gotten a bit of the stolen MERS cash. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. It took me a second to realize that the reason why they were specifically celebrating down there directly after work was because they were given some of the cash from the mayor and by other soups where they're going, you know, well, these guys are definitely better than the spider. They gave us actual cash. You know, spider is just useless. He's in it for the photo op.

[00:16:40] And then we see Ben climb off his stool, go outside for three seconds, put back on the mask and then come back inside as everybody in the room goes, oh, you're the spider. And then he gets into a fight with them. I love this fight. It feels like almost like the drunken master fights from Jackie Chan movies where you have the kung fu hero looking like he's a drunken buffoon over in the corner. And then he bests the people that are fighting against him.

[00:17:11] Here, it's just he's being outnumbered. He does get a baseball bat to the head. And we get a great moment where he hears the radio of the game that's going on, the baseball game going on. The baseball commentary is saying something about, you know, will the player be able to get back after the batting he's taken, you know? So he's kind of using that to inspire himself to get back up. And we have just a very funny moment where he starts webbing people up with the with the call of web, web, web, web, web, web. Yeah, yeah.

[00:17:39] I thought this fight was excellent. I love the use of the webbing here. And not only just to sort of string up or web up his adversaries here, but, you know, there's the bottle crack over the head using it. There's the head into the table, which looked like it would absolutely take that guy out. He's got a good kick on him as well. He kicks a guy into the bar.

[00:18:05] So, like, you see the inherent power that Ben Reilly has as the spider, not just in terms of the use of his webbing. But I love how it's used here. And I like then that Robbie arrives kind of, you know, saying, look, we've got to get you out of here because, you know, this isn't you shouldn't be kind of telling people who you are, really. Yeah. But you have Ben kind of compounding. They don't want the spider. You don't want the spider.

[00:18:35] I don't want the spider running around. You know, they have this quite nice moment between Robbie and Ben post-fight. Yeah. And as Robbie takes the vial and, you know, this conversation about, well, you know, what is it that you really want? You know, if you didn't want to be a super, but why did you put on the mask? Think about why you did that. Everyone's lost a girl, literally like everyone else in New York. So why should they be left without a hero? Yeah.

[00:19:03] And, you know, he goes, I lost everything, but I didn't ask you back, you know, until or if you want, unless you wanted to. Exactly. And so. I wouldn't put any pressure on you, but it would be good for you to look at the rest of the city and see what you could do for it. And maybe take it after helping some other people like you have done as the spider. So take it after helping Lonnie and Flint, you know. Then yourself. Exactly. Exactly. I love the backdrop in this scene.

[00:19:32] It looks like a stage play on steroids. You know, it's this massive scenery of New York in the background. And again, in color, this looks absolutely beautiful. Just the different colors in the background. It's really, really cool. Very impressive. But yeah, lovely scene between Robbie and Ben where Robbie finally gets Ben back on side to be the hero that he needs to be for the city. It's cool. Yeah, definitely. Definitely.

[00:19:57] And what follows with that, you know, as he's reconnected with Robbie, he gets back to the office with Janet and reveals to her that he is the spider. And follows is just this excellent scene of her going, yeah, you've done that for quite often when you're drunk with the montage of him going, yeah, I'm the spider. And then him hanging out of the ceiling, drinking a bottle of whiskey by one hand going and singing. I am your spider. I thought this was absolutely hilarious.

[00:20:26] You know, we had wondered because Janet seemed to be not too surprised about the situations that Ben gets into and the fact that he's a very heavy drinker. We'd wonder how much she knew about Ben's actual history. And yes, it turns out she knows absolutely everything, but just thought it would play better for him if he didn't know, because then he'd be worried about her if he thought that she knew the secret identity. Absolutely. And even the Robbie, he goes, you knew that she knew.

[00:20:54] And so it becomes this little kind of Russian doll of things happening. But yeah, no, it's a great, I shouldn't have told you that. Oh, you already knew. Yeah, the montage is fantastic. I absolutely loved it. Seeing continually walk in on a drunk spider with normally with the mask off. You know, so clear as day that it's Ben Riley. So yeah, this was a great little addition here. It was. I think, should we get on to our web shot number three? Absolutely.

[00:21:25] Number three is treating Tombstone. Because Ben has the antidote and he's been told to treat Lonnie. So the next stage of what he's going to do is go down and try and take down Lonnie and try to save Lonnie. But first, Robbie's going to try and talk Lonnie down. He's going to try and appeal to his better nature. Doesn't go very well. And this is where I think I mentioned earlier on the season.

[00:21:51] This is where I feel the experimentation that's been done on these guys as they've gotten more and more of their powers. It has started to affect their brains. Lonnie seems very willing to kill Robbie in this scene when Robbie's trying to talk him down. He's telling him to get the hell out of there. He's chosen his side with Silvermane. But it feels like he's just a little bit further over the edge than he was previously.

[00:22:15] Once again, willing to be the bad guy, be the actual villain here versus Robbie, even though Robbie's trying to tell him, you know, we can get you. We can save you. We can help you, you know. But not willing to go along with him until Ben Reilly arrives to fight against him. Yeah. Again, another really good fight for me in the kind of warehouse. The classic moment where, where's he gone? And he comes down behind Lonnie. It's great. Jab him in the neck with the syringe.

[00:22:45] And of course, he is totally sort of armored places with the superpower that he's got. It's just so Luke Cage. Yeah. It's really good. And I think ultimately then it's just, you know, the second vial into his eye. You're like, oh my goodness. And again, you can't anticipate will it or won't it work, say, on Lonnie. But it does.

[00:23:12] And so, but, you know, he was about to finish off the spider. And the spider was on the ropes here. And it comes again down to Robbie seeing the loose syringe and then jabbing it into Lonnie's eye. He doesn't seem to have too much of a recovery issue around having a syringe in the eye after it's worked. So maybe it also cured the puncture to his eyeball as well. Definitely.

[00:23:40] But I mean, the only thing I would say here is that the cops that were being bribed by Pudge and Perry as well as Pudge and Perry do take an awful long time to get involved in this. I guess initially they're just like, we'll leave it to Lonnie. Yeah. But I think, I just thought they would be piling in as well. Or at least Pudge and Perry. I get you. But I think they were trying to leave the supers to fight amongst themselves because they don't have Paris.

[00:24:10] That's probably what it was. But, and, you know, remember, they probably faced off against the spider multiple times when he was at his full strength five years ago because they've been around Silverman for quite a while. And even though Ben was in retirement, they might have faced off of them in the past at some point. So they kind of went, right, super Lonnie can take care of it. But as soon as he's turned, the police turn on Lonnie and Spider.

[00:24:38] So they have to fight side by side together. Again, really reminiscent of comic book team ups, right? Marvel team ups with Spider-Man and one of his villains against the other enemy. And this is the corrupt cops in New York. So I really like that. I don't know why, but it really made me laugh when they escaped out of there in one of the cop cars and just heard one of the cops going, that's my car. As if he can't get home to his family or something. It's the way you said it. It just made me laugh. Yeah, absolutely.

[00:25:05] So we have one of the guys cured and they take him back to Robbie's apartment. Yes. Yeah, that leads us into our webshop number four. It does. Yes, a sleeping spider. One of the interesting things that happened in the fight with Lonnie is that Ben seems to run out of webbing. It's interesting, isn't it? Because throughout the series, we've realized that Ben's webbing is much more like Tobey Maguire's Spider-Man.

[00:25:34] It comes directly from his wrist. It's natural rather than created by him. And here he runs out of the weapon because he's used so much of it in this episode, especially in the bar fight. And now he is absolutely collapsing because he's used so much of his powers in this one day, in this battle in the bar and with Lonnie. So he has to go back and rest up in Robbie's apartment.

[00:25:59] So our webshop number four is sleeping spider because he has to rest up back in Robbie's place, right? Yeah. I mean, it's an interesting side effect of him using his powers really here. For that long. And that, yeah, if he uses them for too long, he runs out of the actual webbing. You certainly don't want that whilst you're swinging from skyscraper to skyscraper. But I like the fact that when he sleeps, he's on his back with his arms up and his legs up. It's hilarious.

[00:26:28] Which is like sort of happy baby pose, isn't it? Or whatever he's doing. Oh, baby, yeah. I thought it was just like a spider that's curled up. Yeah, no, I guess so. But dead on its back. True. It just looks really hilarious. Yeah, and Lonnie kind of going, should we like get him a doctor or like get him some pills or something? And Robbie just going, I'll just let him sleep. Exactly. And I love Robbie comes over to Ben and says, no, you can't go out of here. You've got to rest. And Ben goes, no, I can't do that. I've got to rest. Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's really funny.

[00:26:57] There's some nice moments here. You know, Lonnie is asking Robbie, why did he do it? And you just get this little insight from Robbie saying, well, despite what he wants everyone else to believe, you know, he is actually a good person. And we kind of see this discussion between Lonnie and Robbie as two black men, you know, about, well, where are you going to go? Are you going to try and get out of this life of crime?

[00:27:24] Because we did have earlier on where he says that to Flint, but in the end he comes back, you know, he comes in with Flint, probably down to loyalty to Flint as much as to anything else. But here he says, well, I'm going to head to Canada for a new life with his mother. Yeah.

[00:27:43] But also he imparts, you know, a little bit of some, like, self-confidence back to Robbie saying a city needs a man like you as much as the spider to give that viewpoint. You know, I think he's telling Robbie a black man's written article is needed in this city. Absolutely.

[00:28:13] To give the news, to give that viewpoint, to give that standpoint and perspective on the news. Yeah. And why fight uphill at the Daily Bugle where they don't want you anyway? You can write better for another place. Yeah. Really, really, really good conversation they have there. And the other thing to remember, of course, the reason why Lonnie did stay in the life of crime was because he was being told his life was finite. Especially now that he is fully armoured as Tombstone. Soon enough, the day will come when he'll die.

[00:28:42] So he couldn't get out of town. He was now super-powered and would be dead soon. So now that he's got a new lease of life, he's going off to Niagara Falls. And I love the final line between the two of them where Robbie questions the decision going, you do like maple syrup. And he goes, as much as the next guy. Which means he doesn't really know. There's nothing fundamental in his nature that makes him into maple syrup. But yeah, just an interesting one about the recovery of the spider there.

[00:29:12] There's some interesting lines all the way throughout this from Nicolas Cage about the nature of spiders. Especially when he's rambling to Eamon at the bar. And the way that he's resting, as you mentioned, John. But just some interesting stuff about spiders not having any bones at all. And that their limbs are more like straws than skeletons. You know, that kind of stuff. It feels like in the research that Nicolas Cage did for the role of playing a human spider, he found all of these facts that he wanted to throw into the episodes.

[00:29:42] It could be that. Maybe it was the writer. It probably was the writer, to be honest. But I do like the way Nicolas Cage delivered all of those as well. Yeah, it was good. Lying on his back as well. And then on his side. And then kind of, yeah, just sort of chunnering and gibberish whilst he's in his kind of deep rest. And coming out of it occasionally. Yeah. No, it's just a nice little moment here in the episode. And I think in particular between Robbie and Lonnie here.

[00:30:12] But we see Lonnie leaving the apartment, putting on his hat for a new life as he walks away from his life of crime. Absolutely. Absolutely. Let's get on to our final web shot with that, John. Bring me Ben Reilly. That's what I've called the last one of our web shots, John.

[00:30:35] Because, as we mentioned up front, these two scenes are being done in parallel with Silvermane and Mayor Morris finding out that Ben Reilly cured Tombstone. You know, it's the police chief that has one of the syringes that's been emptied, who brings it in, saying his men are reporting that Lonnie is now back to human. That they have got the detail. And then on the other side, we have Pudge and Perry bringing the vial back to Silvermane.

[00:31:03] The other vial, the one with the bent nib on it, I think it is. They bring that back to Silvermane. I really, really love how angry Silvermane is getting at the idea that he's just lost another one of his men. And the two guys are like, but we have the vial. This is what happened. This is what the spider did. And he's going, have some goddamn specificity when you talk to me. I want details of what happened. And they both come to the same conclusion at the same time. They need to speak to the spider.

[00:31:30] And therefore, they need to get their connection, which for both of them is Ben Reilly. Love it. Yeah, absolutely. I just thought how this ended, actually, in the same way as it opened this episode. This was really, really good. I like how you get this great split screen. You know, you have this thing, Morris down 12 points.

[00:31:54] McNamara tells Murr that Silvermane has effectively lost Lonnie, that the spider has taken him off the board. And then you get this split screen where you have Pudge and Perry telling Silvermane exactly what's happened. Yeah. As McNamara tells the Murr. And it splits between the two. It splits, you know, to the room. And then both of them, as you say, saying, get Ben right. I just loved how that was designed, to be honest.

[00:32:24] Yeah. And I think it really bookends the episode really well. And it's just, in terms of the opener, you have Kat's flashback to piano, where it's the audio of the two men that she has strung along. Or at least loved both of them, in Flint, Marco, and Ben Reilly. Yeah.

[00:32:48] And it's done in a very similar way of both through audio, just the split audio between Flint and Ben as she's playing on the piano. Cuts to face, cuts to the hands on the piano as you get these flashbacks of how Kat has been involved with these two men. Yeah. That is really critical. It's really good. To this show.

[00:33:10] So having this ending then done in that visual way, just really, really nicely thought out. Absolutely. You know, I really enjoyed it. Yeah. Yeah. Really good. That's our major points for the episode. John, any notes? Anything you didn't mention? The only one I have is just Flint creeping in Kat's wardrobe when she walks in. But ultimately here, you get that Kat really loves Flint.

[00:33:40] Flint, it's not Ben Reilly, because she says, you knew I could be bad, but you just accepted it in me. Yes. And, you know, Flint has this warning to her to say, you know, I'm not going to tell Silvermane, but he's smart and he'll find out eventually. And once I'm dead, he'll find out. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I think you realize the genuine affection and love between these two characters.

[00:34:10] Like, I think Flint says, life has no taste without you. You know, I'm long gone, effectively, at this stage. I can't just bite my pride and come back here. Yeah. She's going, I'm right here. You haven't lost me. I'm right here and just saying I'm long gone. So this was an important part, I think, of this episode, because primarily it's that you realize that Kat actually does really love Flint. And it's been borne out in this series.

[00:34:39] You know, she has put her life on the line to rid herself of the controlling influence of Silvermane. Exactly. It's the big threat to her and her love and relationship with Flint. Absolutely. So, yeah, I think that's my only main note here. Very good. I just have one quick one just because it's a really interesting one that Janet notices that Ben's looking very yellow after the last time she saw him. I can't remember what the medical term on this is. It's jaundice.

[00:35:09] From losing his liver, maybe? Well, yeah, it's definitely to do with his liver. I'm sure of it, I think. I think that's what the jaundice, the yellow look. I suspect he's not lost it. I think it's just been heavily sampled. Yeah. Possibly. I think so. But I don't think, because there's only one. So unless the soup powers mean that he can survive without a liver, then he wouldn't be processing that alcohol very well.

[00:35:37] Yeah, he's certainly not processing it that well. Anyway, but he never has. But I always like in what is a show that most people will be watching in black and white because everybody thinks that's the way you're supposed to be watching it. I love when somebody calls out the color of something in the show. So Janet saying, you're looking quite yellow today. It's quite interesting since you probably have to switch over to color to see that he is actually looking quite pale and yellow. Absolutely. So John, one more thing to do. Do you defend Spider-Man Noir Episode 7, Nobody's Hero? Absolutely.

[00:36:07] Really enjoyed this episode. I think there's a lot going on in it. I love the opener and the closer here to this episode. I love that we see their montage. There's just some really nice moments. Two great fights in it. Absolutely. So for me, I give this five camel holes in a sandstorm out of five to kind of roughly quote Silvermane.

[00:36:32] Yeah, I just think it's got some really nice beats here between some of the main characters like Robbie and Ben on the bench after the fight in the bar. You've got the bar brawl. You have that moment between Kat and Janet as well, where she kind of gets the measure of Kat as Janet. Yeah. Doesn't know it exactly to the letter in terms of that she stood him up, but she certainly knows there's something not quite right.

[00:37:02] And then you have that moment with Lonnie and Robbie back at Robbie's apartment as well, which I think is really good. Yeah. As well as the big reveal of Kat's real love here. Ben Reilly was just something else, which I guess we will hopefully find out about, you know. Or it was just a way of escaping the inevitability of Silvermane. But now, as you say, now she knows the antidote is on the table.

[00:37:32] It reaffirms her feelings towards him, I guess. So, yeah, five camel holes in a sandstorm. Derek, do you defend this episode of Spider Noir, episode seven, Nobody's Hero? Yeah, absolutely defend this. Really enjoyed this, particularly the bar fights. That was great.

[00:37:53] And I loved the curing of Lonnie as you think everything's lost when you can't get the syringe into Lonnie's hardened skin. And Robbie jumps up to stab him in the eye to save him. That's really good. Yeah, some really great moments in this. You mentioned a lot of them there. So I'll leave it at that. A great episode and really, really sets up what will be a fun finale for this season of the show. Yeah, looking forward to it. Let's get on to some feedback from our wonderful fellow defenders.

[00:38:23] First up, over on Discord, Joe Herbst says, Lonnie's disposition and allegiance flipped on a dime once he was stuck in the eye. Him reversing back to normal physically made a lot more sense than the first guy de-aging when he got the antidote. I guess, though, in last week's episode, or in the last episode, that was the terrible superpower that he had, was that his whole body was being dragged into aging. So that was just reversed by the superpower being taken away, right?

[00:38:50] So I guess they're similar in this world, I guess. Yeah. I guess so. Yeah. Yeah. I do understand where you're coming from, Joe. Thanks so much for that, Joe. Thanks, Joe. Also on Discord, Dr. Bob says, So what if they failed the Bechamel Test and the Bechamel Test? This show, with its love of matte backdrops, air siren-announced cliffhangers, rapidly resolving jaundice, reluctant terrorism,

[00:39:19] and the most gorgeous mirror bottle camera work, is a resounding success. I really hope they'll stick the landing. Of course, passing the Bechamel Test is when two women are on screen, not talking about a man. The Bechamel Test is when you see a kitchen, and it has someone furiously making a roux over a low flame and swearing. Oh, Derek, that's you. Thank you, Dr. Bob. I am absolutely terrible at roux. You're not.

[00:39:47] The roux is his nemesis. It is. I roux the roux. That is all. Yep, I roux the roux. Definitely. It's my least favourite thing to make in the world. So I always fail the Bechamel Test. Yes. But I completely agree. I think there's some great camera work in this. There's some lovely kind of actual design for the shots and for what we're seeing, whether it's from a visual or an audio perspective.

[00:40:15] No matter whether you're watching it in black and white or colour, I totally agree with you there, Dr. Bob. Yeah, it's absolutely beautiful, particularly this episode. Some great scenes. Great stuff. Thanks, Dr. Bob. We also have an email in from Coffee and Vodka, of course. She says, Greetings, fellow besotted defenders. The mysteries turned out to be obvious. The betrayal is deep, but expected. And characters not quite as marily murky as once thought, but the style of it all. Now, with the end in sight,

[00:40:42] it seems the conclusion be as safely guessed as an old school comic book. Again, however, all part of the charm. This episode in particular, as well as showing some real plot traction, was just plain fun. Off to the finale. 4.5 unhappy errors, evidentiary clearance sales, and helpful pricks out of five. Peace and take care. Coffee and vodka. Excellent stuff. Thank you, coffee and vodka. Yeah, I think, again, this is a really great episode.

[00:41:11] It's really charming, I think, as you say. Style of it, I've mentioned already. Whilst a lot of it is certainly sort of being sort of pulled out now into the open, it's good to see it, seeing some, as you say, some real plot traction. I think it's not just plot traction, it's just that character interaction where it's kind of built over the course of the series,

[00:41:35] and now we come to the crux of why Robbie is aligned with the spider. You know, why Janet is aligned with Ben and the spider, knowing that he is the spider. So it's all really good. I think totally with you there, coffee and vodka. Yeah, I really agree with you, coffee and vodka. I think here the show is all about the style. It doesn't really matter about the big reveals of things that could possibly happen. The bad guys are bad guys, the good guys are good guys.

[00:42:04] A little bit of a grey area there with Drunken Ben, but he will become the hero again, I'm sure of it. But the actual style of the show and the acting and the character development and what's going on between the characters is all the fun to watch each time we turn on an episode. So I really, really enjoy each episode of the show. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. That's it for our chat all about Spider-Man Noir, episode 7. Next time we are back with the finale, episode 8, The Man in the Mask. Looking forward to talking about it.

[00:42:34] Yeah, absolutely. Cannot wait for the finale of this series. Thank you so much, fellow defenders, for joining us. Of course, if you love the podcast, please share it because sharing the podcast is sharing the love. But until next time, keep watching, keep listening, and of course, keep defending. Absolutely. And keep wearing sunscreen as well. Keep cooling. Bye. Bye. Bye.