Derek and John are back for the second arc of Season 2 with The Sandman 204 "Brief Lives. We dive deep into the quest of Delirium and Dream to find their missing sibling. Join us for our spoiler filled chat all about it.
Season 2, Episode 4 of The Sandman "Brief Lives"
Episode teleplay by Austin Guzman
Episode directed by Jamie Childs
Synopsis: The youngest of the Endless, Delirium, unexpectedly pays a visit to her older brother Dream. She wants his help in finding their absent brother, Destruction. Reluctant at first, Dream agrees, secretly hoping to encounter Nada on Earth instead of his brother. Destruction is seen engaging in painting and poetry, accompanied by Barnabas, a talking dog, on a remote island. Dream and Delirium enlist Wanda, a transgender woman and employee of Dream's old friend, to help them track down Destruction's contacts. The first of them, however, dies just before they find him and Dream grows suspicious that an unknown force is preventing them from finding Destruction. Next, they seek Ishtar, an old god and Destruction's former lover who, depowered without worship, works as a club dancer. After a heated discussion with Dream, Ishtar performs a mesmerizing dance for her audience, but a sudden explosion kills everyone in the club including Ishtar and Wanda. With a hint from Desire, Delirium realises Dream was lying to her about wanting to find Destruction.
Now knowing that all he wanted to do was track down his former lover Nada, Delirium leaves her siblings in anger.
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Thanks for joining us for our podcast all about The Sandman Season 2 Episode 4 "Brief Lives". We'll be back next time with our discussions about The Sandman Season 2 Episode 5 “The Song of Orpheus” as a new arc begins for the series.
Thanks so much for joining us fellow Dreamers.
John and Derek
TV Podcast Industries
The music for this episode "Lucille" by Zenji is licensed under a Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivatives (Creative Commons 4.0)
00:00 --> 00:08 [SPEAKER_03]: This is the Sandman podcast on TV podcast industries we're back with the Sandman season two chapter four brief lives.
00:09 --> 00:10 [SPEAKER_00]: I knew you'd be this way.
00:11 --> 00:13 [SPEAKER_00]: You're always so scary.
00:14 --> 00:17 [SPEAKER_00]: So I thought I'd really try to be good.
00:18 --> 00:20 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm trying very hard to be good.
00:23 --> 00:25 [SPEAKER_00]: But you're still being horrid to me.
00:26 --> 00:28 [SPEAKER_00]: And laughing at me behind your face like you always do.
00:30 --> 00:32 [SPEAKER_00]: And I really was trying this time.
00:37 --> 00:40 [SPEAKER_01]: I've been somewhat distracted as of late.
00:43 --> 00:43 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not angry with you.
00:47 --> 00:47 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry.
00:51 --> 00:52 [SPEAKER_00]: You just apologize to me.
00:55 --> 00:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
00:58 --> 00:59 [SPEAKER_00]: You never apologize.
01:00 --> 01:03 [SPEAKER_00]: You can suck like you, no stuff I don't know that makes everything you do, okay?
01:05 --> 01:05 [SPEAKER_01]: I see.
01:06 --> 01:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I have to apologize.
01:09 --> 01:11 [SPEAKER_01]: And why don't you tell me why it is you came here?
01:31 --> 01:40 [SPEAKER_03]: Welcome back fellow dreamers to TV podcast industries and the Sandman podcast we're back with the Sandman season two episode for brief lives.
01:40 --> 01:45 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm one of your host Derek hello there and welcome back fellow dreamers.
01:45 --> 01:50 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm your other host on this dreamy tale of the Sandman John.
01:51 --> 01:51 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, welcome back John.
01:52 --> 01:53 [SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
01:53 --> 02:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we've been podcasting a loads of other stuff and also had our holiday and we're then back with the second arc of the San Man as we start chapter four obviously.
02:03 --> 02:14 [SPEAKER_05]: We've been furiously doing the eyes of Wakanda for episode Marvel animation series all about different war dogs for
02:14 --> 02:16 [SPEAKER_05]: from Wakanda across time.
02:17 --> 02:30 [SPEAKER_05]: And yes, we were also catching up and writing our notes on everything in the next three episode installment of this second season of the Sandman.
02:30 --> 02:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
02:30 --> 02:33 [SPEAKER_05]: So covering the arc of the search for
02:34 --> 02:36 [SPEAKER_03]: Destruction.
02:36 --> 02:36 [SPEAKER_03]: Spoilers.
02:38 --> 02:41 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, the name of the final member of the endless has been revealed.
02:42 --> 02:43 [SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't down to line, then.
02:43 --> 02:44 [SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't down to line, though.
02:44 --> 02:45 [SPEAKER_03]: They're well-dandy.
02:46 --> 02:48 [SPEAKER_03]: It's totally because of Dougie.
02:48 --> 02:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, Davey.
02:48 --> 02:50 [SPEAKER_05]: Because we do have a Dougie in the episode.
02:50 --> 02:50 [SPEAKER_05]: We certainly do.
02:50 --> 02:52 [SPEAKER_05]: We have a very cute thought of this.
02:52 --> 02:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I want that dog.
02:54 --> 02:54 [SPEAKER_05]: He's very good.
02:54 --> 02:55 [SPEAKER_05]: I really want that dog.
02:55 --> 02:56 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.
02:56 --> 02:58 [SPEAKER_05]: I just probably just an animation, but nonetheless.
02:59 --> 03:03 [SPEAKER_03]: I guess it's gorgeous dog, absolutely gorgeous dog, but with the voice of Steve Cooke, and I'm not too sure where they're going for that.
03:05 --> 03:07 [SPEAKER_03]: Please be able to communicate easily enough.
03:08 --> 03:09 [SPEAKER_03]: Give me food, I think.
03:09 --> 03:10 [SPEAKER_03]: You're not very good at poetry.
03:10 --> 03:13 [SPEAKER_03]: It's quite sharp as well.
03:13 --> 03:19 [SPEAKER_03]: But yes, into the second part of this season of the Sandman, just to say before
03:19 --> 03:20 [SPEAKER_03]: We go into our coverage.
03:20 --> 03:30 [SPEAKER_03]: If you haven't subscribed to the podcast, you can pop on our TV podcast and it's worth waiting to get the aforementioned eyes of O'Con, the podcast which is all available over there on TV.castindustries.com.
03:30 --> 03:37 [SPEAKER_03]: Pop on our subscribe to any podcast catcher of your choice or dream catcher of your choice, whatever way you want to do.
03:37 --> 03:52 [SPEAKER_03]: You can also pop it over to our Facebook group at Facebook.com slash groups slash TV podcast industries where you can leave your feedback in any of the Sandman spoiler posts that are up there for each of the episodes of this season to the second and final season of the Sandman as well.
03:52 --> 03:53 [SPEAKER_03]: We'd love to hear your thoughts.
03:54 --> 04:00 [SPEAKER_03]: If you want to email us, you can email us to feedback at TVpodcastindustries.com with your feedback in any of the episodes as well.
04:00 --> 04:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Excellent stuff.
04:01 --> 04:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Shall we get into our spoiler filled discussion?
04:04 --> 04:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.
04:05 --> 04:05 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, of course.
04:05 --> 04:08 [SPEAKER_03]: We're going into the first part of Brief Lives.
04:08 --> 04:14 [SPEAKER_03]: This is based on the arc in the comic books called Brief Lives from issue forty one to forty nine.
04:14 --> 04:22 [SPEAKER_03]: But does also cover the Sandman special number when the song of Orfius, which you'll see a lot more of in the second part of this trilogy of episodes as well.
04:23 --> 04:32 [SPEAKER_03]: But if you're following on and you want to pick up even the collected edition, there's a collected edition called Brief Lives, which is issues forty one to forty nine about eight issues overall covering this storyline.
04:33 --> 04:33 [SPEAKER_03]: Excellent.
04:34 --> 04:35 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, good stuff.
04:35 --> 04:45 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm really enjoying how at least these first six episodes are kind of neatly bundled into these arcs of three episodes in the story.
04:45 --> 04:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Kind of in relatively self-contained, but be interesting to see how they link together, which I'm guessing it will be heading towards the little desire side of the fence.
04:57 --> 04:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Obviously, someone who hasn't read.
05:00 --> 05:04 [SPEAKER_05]: the comics and that's my current speculation.
05:04 --> 05:14 [SPEAKER_05]: That's the old Dezerre will be, yeah, somewhere behind a mask in the shadows.
05:15 --> 05:16 [SPEAKER_05]: behind a book.
05:16 --> 05:17 [SPEAKER_03]: It's something like that.
05:17 --> 05:22 [SPEAKER_03]: It's an interesting concept as suppose that the big change that we have here in season two of the same amount.
05:22 --> 05:29 [SPEAKER_03]: I kind of say despite the fact that the the executives of the show on Heinberg says that they were only climbing two seasons.
05:29 --> 05:34 [SPEAKER_03]: They were cutting everything into just the story of Morpheus and it was always supposed to end with a second season.
05:34 --> 05:36 [SPEAKER_03]: I kind of feel like it wasn't.
05:36 --> 05:52 [SPEAKER_03]: There's a lot of crushing of characters, a lot of characters and I started to be merged together so that they can tell the story as I mentioned, some of the next couple of episodes is being taken from a side story, the song of Orpheus, and being pushed in here to the brief lives arc.
05:52 --> 05:55 [SPEAKER_03]: There is a lot of changes being made, so I don't actually know where it's going to end.
05:56 --> 05:58 [SPEAKER_03]: I think the end point is going to be the same as the other books.
05:58 --> 06:03 [SPEAKER_03]: They're going to get there a lot quicker, and I'm just wondering what they're going to be bringing in from the surrounding
06:03 --> 06:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Thirty or forty comic books.
06:04 --> 06:12 [SPEAKER_03]: I think right here where as I say we're up to issue forty one to forty nine, which is already jumped about thirty issues of the comic from the last episode.
06:12 --> 06:13 [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, interesting.
06:13 --> 06:13 [SPEAKER_03]: Something like that.
06:13 --> 06:16 [SPEAKER_03]: It's about twenty issues maybe from the last episode.
06:16 --> 06:20 [SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, so quite a bit that is being left out of the overall storyline.
06:20 --> 06:24 [SPEAKER_03]: But yes, the main thread of what's happening with more fears in the end.
06:24 --> 06:26 [SPEAKER_03]: This is the is the central story that's here.
06:26 --> 06:29 [SPEAKER_03]: So let's see how it ends as we get into the series.
06:29 --> 06:32 [SPEAKER_03]: But the exact opportunity for the show, as I mentioned there, Alan Heinberg, Jamie Charles, and David S. Gore,
06:33 --> 06:39 [SPEAKER_03]: The episodes all directed by Jamie Childs this season and this episode the telly play for it was written by Austin Gosman.
06:39 --> 06:41 [SPEAKER_03]: He wrote season one episode for a hope and hell.
06:41 --> 06:46 [SPEAKER_03]: That's the one where Morpheus faced off against Lucifer in their battle back in hell.
06:46 --> 06:49 [SPEAKER_03]: I think it was also the episode that Nada was introduced last season.
06:49 --> 06:55 [SPEAKER_03]: So interesting that Austin has to deal with the fall light of the first arc of the season that the star of this episode as well.
06:55 --> 06:57 [SPEAKER_03]: It's quite an interesting touch.
06:57 --> 06:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
06:57 --> 07:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it is, because all dreamy is being all mopey, and it's raining, it's so upset, and it's life's unfair, and he's going to flick that fringe in despair.
07:11 --> 07:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Absolutely almost.
07:12 --> 07:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, yeah.
07:12 --> 07:13 [SPEAKER_02]: He's just doing it.
07:15 --> 07:18 [SPEAKER_03]: But John, do you want to tell us what they gave us with your synopsis for?
07:18 --> 07:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Season two, episode four, Grief Lives.
07:21 --> 07:27 [SPEAKER_05]: Sure, the youngest of the endless delirium unexpectedly pays a visit to our older brother, Dream.
07:28 --> 07:31 [SPEAKER_05]: She wants his help in finding their absent brother, destruction.
07:31 --> 07:38 [SPEAKER_05]: Reluctant at first, Dream agrees secretly hoping to encounter Nada on Earth, instead of his brother.
07:38 --> 07:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Meanwhile, destruction is engaging in painting and poetry on a remote isolated island accompanied by Barnabas talking dog.
07:48 --> 07:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Little does he know that Dream and Delirium enlist Wanda a transgender woman and employee of Dream's old friend to help them track down destruction's contacts.
07:58 --> 08:08 [SPEAKER_05]: The first of them however, Bernard Capex dies just before they find him, and dream grows suspicious that an unknown force is preventing them from finding destruction.
08:09 --> 08:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Next they seek Ishtar, an old god and destruction's former lover, who, depowered without worship, works as a club dancer.
08:18 --> 08:29 [SPEAKER_05]: After a heated discussion with Dream, Ishtop performs a mesmerising dance for her audience, but a sudden explosion kills everyone in the club, including Ishtop and Wonder.
08:29 --> 08:35 [SPEAKER_05]: With a hint from Desire, Delirium realizes Dream was lying to her about wanting to find destruction.
08:36 --> 08:43 [SPEAKER_05]: And now knowing that all he wanted to do was track down his former lover, Nada, Delirium leaves her siblings in anger.
08:44 --> 08:47 [SPEAKER_03]: So yeah, new quest, um, off to find a destruction.
08:47 --> 08:54 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, we talked about it in the first arc of this season that I was willing to go off to hell and leave behind everything that he'd lost for a hundred years.
08:54 --> 08:58 [SPEAKER_03]: Um, and here he is again, uh, second, second half of the season and off he goes again, uh, leaving
09:00 --> 09:04 [SPEAKER_03]: the land of the dreaming in the hands of Lucien.
09:05 --> 09:07 [SPEAKER_05]: He's really leaving his responsibility.
09:07 --> 09:18 [SPEAKER_05]: It's interesting because in terms of the top moments of delirium comes to enlist dream in the search for destruction and a triple D, I guess.
09:22 --> 09:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Dream keeps talking about he abandoned us, he abandoned his realm, he abandoned his responsibilities.
09:28 --> 09:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, Dream seems to be doing a lot of that abandonment himself and it is very lucky that the Lord of Dreams does have such a conscientious librarian in Louisiana and who seems to be holding it all together.
09:43 --> 09:47 [SPEAKER_05]: What with his sort of side quests to find Nardre, now again a
09:50 --> 09:54 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, not said side quest to find Nadra again.
09:54 --> 10:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Stringing his younger sister's leader in a long, you know, he is effectively not getting back into the dreaming and he is not just getting on with his responsibilities, it for his realm.
10:08 --> 10:17 [SPEAKER_05]: So it's kind of an interesting parallel here that comes across that, okay, whilst he hasn't sort of run away in hidden,
10:19 --> 10:26 [SPEAKER_05]: He is sort of doing exactly what he's moaning about towards destruction.
10:26 --> 10:27 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, absolutely.
10:27 --> 10:34 [SPEAKER_03]: And if you go back to just the opening of the episode, as we mentioned him moping in the rain, the base, his loss of Nada and then telling the staff,
10:35 --> 11:00 [SPEAKER_03]: none of them are allowed to speak about it anymore and the first thing he does is he's an opening that he go off and find or maybe possibly if he runs into a bumps into a possibly inner throne and maybe she'll take him back or maybe she'll reconsider his decision you know it's just so it is so teenage boy moping about the loss of the first girlfriend isn't it well exactly a girlfriend that he put into hell for ten thousand years so
11:00 --> 11:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Well that's it and even you know when desire is called upon by dream to sort of you know check around delirium's request and you know I mean delirium anyway says that you know she tried to get hold of despair who said no delirium said no so she's come to him but more of his speaks with desire and desire kind of tells more of you know to
11:25 --> 11:33 [SPEAKER_05]: She's gonna leave so that you can go back to doing what you like to do, which is feeling sorry for yourself and moving around.
11:33 --> 11:45 [SPEAKER_05]: It's another kind of tense exchange where more of you think it's more a desire who has had a role in this scheme of delirium.
11:45 --> 11:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Again, this sort of tense exchange, maybe this paranoia at this stage from dream around,
11:52 --> 11:55 [SPEAKER_05]: the influence and web of desire.
11:56 --> 12:01 [SPEAKER_05]: But, you know, it's really kind of under the tense exchange.
12:01 --> 12:10 [SPEAKER_05]: But ultimately, Dream sees that he can, you know, head on with Delirium.
12:10 --> 12:20 [SPEAKER_05]: sort of acquiesce to her wishes because it provides him with another chance to walk in the waking world and possibly bump into Nada.
12:20 --> 12:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly.
12:21 --> 12:23 [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, it's kind of interesting all this.
12:23 --> 12:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Again, it sees how manipulative he is when he's accusing desire of being that as well.
12:33 --> 12:36 [SPEAKER_05]: it's all reflective here and I can really really enjoy that.
12:36 --> 13:01 [SPEAKER_05]: The other little point I make here is I like that desires as is the return to sit on and he gets a really sort of tough looking sparse wooden chair like and that only the most puritanical person would sit on to stick forks into their leg and and then desire turns it into a shes launch which I thought was
13:02 --> 13:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Great.
13:02 --> 13:03 [SPEAKER_05]: I'd love to be able to do that.
13:04 --> 13:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Just turn any chair that looks so uncomfortable.
13:07 --> 13:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Like once you get a airport, so you don't have, you know, just into that comfy sofa.
13:12 --> 13:14 [SPEAKER_05]: And to a show, yes.
13:14 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Excellent skill to have.
13:16 --> 13:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Good old desire.
13:17 --> 13:18 [SPEAKER_03]: They always know what you'll be interested in.
13:18 --> 13:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, absolutely.
13:21 --> 13:24 [SPEAKER_03]: But yes, I love these attractions with Blue Ribbon and Dream here.
13:24 --> 13:27 [SPEAKER_03]: It's, you know, this character is a favorite from the comic book.
13:27 --> 13:28 [SPEAKER_03]: It absolutely loves Blue Ribbon.
13:29 --> 13:40 [SPEAKER_03]: Even just the arrival of her the moment that she arrives is at the most at the most opportune moment because poor Lucien is being asked by Mopi dream Whether she thinks she's capable of love.
13:41 --> 13:42 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, no poor Lucien.
13:42 --> 13:46 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, she's employed by the dream lord here and being asked Do you think I'm capable of love?
13:46 --> 13:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Do you think any of the ends are capable of love?
13:49 --> 13:53 [SPEAKER_03]: But it's all interrupted by Matthew the Raven who comes in to tell and to tell
13:54 --> 13:56 [SPEAKER_03]: Dream that his sister has been captured by the Big Wyvern.
13:56 --> 14:00 [SPEAKER_03]: I saw it two things that Delirium's there to break into the place.
14:00 --> 14:17 [SPEAKER_03]: But there's this whole conversation between the two and the reason why Delirium has to tear it up in his realm is because unlike most of the other members of the sibling group of the Endless, who dreamt tends to call on quite regularly, every time Delirium tries to call on Morphius, he ignores the call.
14:17 --> 14:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Every time he gets a call from his younger sister, he's been ignoring the call.
14:20 --> 14:22 [SPEAKER_03]: So he's sending it to voicemail, I guess.
14:23 --> 14:24 [SPEAKER_03]: in some sense.
14:24 --> 14:24 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
14:24 --> 14:24 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
14:24 --> 14:25 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
14:25 --> 14:26 [SPEAKER_03]: The Ethereum has to tear it up.
14:26 --> 14:30 [SPEAKER_03]: And then he apologizes to her because he's been distracted recently.
14:30 --> 14:34 [SPEAKER_03]: And that sends off the little bells inside the Ethereum's head going hang of the seconds.
14:35 --> 14:38 [SPEAKER_03]: You've never apologize for anything in all of eternity.
14:38 --> 14:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
14:38 --> 14:40 [SPEAKER_03]: Why are you suddenly apologizing to me now?
14:40 --> 14:41 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, so she knows there's something wrong.
14:42 --> 14:55 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm probably feels he needs this trip as much as she does to go and find their brother destruction and maybe maybe dream could get some help out of their brother and maybe answers to some of his questions.
14:55 --> 14:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and it's interesting.
14:56 --> 14:57 [SPEAKER_05]: He doesn't know that.
14:57 --> 14:57 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
14:57 --> 14:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
14:59 --> 15:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And he sees it as a way of, I guess trying to
15:04 --> 15:14 [SPEAKER_05]: self-inflicted more sort of torture and moping us onto him by trying to find, or not find in a world of, you know, billions, and Nada.
15:14 --> 15:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, exactly.
15:16 --> 15:17 [SPEAKER_05]: There's no where she's gone.
15:17 --> 15:17 [SPEAKER_05]: No idea.
15:17 --> 15:24 [SPEAKER_05]: And interestingly, here we have Delirium, you know, this journey together, but she has
15:26 --> 15:34 [SPEAKER_05]: three people to ask friends, former friends and acquaintances of destruction.
15:34 --> 15:35 [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly, exactly.
15:35 --> 15:51 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and we'll get into the people that they meet on the quest, I guess, at another point in a minute, by just what I mentioned, just this other thing about this conversation, this quest that's going on with the Larian where she's asking Dream to a company or Dream's also not the first person she's asked.
15:51 --> 15:54 [SPEAKER_03]: She's already asked desire and despair, and they both said no.
15:55 --> 16:05 [SPEAKER_03]: and she also doesn't think the dreams going to say yes either because dreams quite a scary guy to deliver him so she's thinking of asking death and then thinking of asking destiny and then there's that little moment that
16:06 --> 16:12 [SPEAKER_03]: I think you just fall for delirium because she goes and then if they all said no to me, I'd go off on my own.
16:12 --> 16:16 [SPEAKER_03]: But I tend to get lost because I'm quite forgetful at times.
16:16 --> 16:22 [SPEAKER_03]: And if you don't come with me and death doesn't come with me and destiny doesn't come with me because destiny wouldn't come with me.
16:22 --> 16:25 [SPEAKER_03]: But then I'll be all alone and then I might get lost in everything again.
16:25 --> 16:28 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, it's just that those things about delirium that I think
16:29 --> 16:41 [SPEAKER_03]: make her such an interesting character to follow because without the guidance of one of the other siblings, she tends to get lost in the world, can see it lost in her thoughts and can't stay focused.
16:41 --> 16:48 [SPEAKER_03]: So having someone like Dream by her side who is the most focused member of the endless by the sides of the things are at least you think she is.
16:49 --> 16:50 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a really good pairing.
16:51 --> 17:00 [SPEAKER_05]: but a great kind of trait for delirium, that, you know, she's delirious and she can't keep focus, it's ultimately.
17:01 --> 17:04 [SPEAKER_05]: So I love how that manifests itself through this portrayal.
17:05 --> 17:12 [SPEAKER_05]: It's really good from Esme Creed Miles, I think, here, how that is put across.
17:13 --> 17:16 [SPEAKER_05]: It's really good to get a bit more, you know,
17:17 --> 17:21 [SPEAKER_05]: detail and spend a bit more time with it.
17:22 --> 17:22 [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.
17:22 --> 17:25 [SPEAKER_03]: So let's get on to the second point of the top moments from the episode.
17:25 --> 17:29 [SPEAKER_03]: We have some of the people that they're going to meet on their journey.
17:29 --> 17:31 [SPEAKER_03]: So there are a couple of
17:33 --> 17:45 [SPEAKER_03]: Contacts, I guess, the delirium fields would be the right people to contact, so people that knew destruction in the past, maybe they'll be able to point them in the right direction, maybe destruction kept in contact with them, even though he stopped being contact with the endless.
17:45 --> 17:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, and it's interesting, as well, we should point out that in initiating this quest, this journey,
17:56 --> 18:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Destruction does have this as he calls it an early warning system.
18:00 --> 18:06 [SPEAKER_05]: So he has this scrying pool, which warns him of trouble or people trying to seek him out.
18:06 --> 18:16 [SPEAKER_05]: And then as we move through this list that Delirium has, we see the results of this scrying pool and what happens.
18:17 --> 18:22 [SPEAKER_05]: But I felt that was quite an interesting little introduction to
18:23 --> 18:37 [SPEAKER_05]: to destruction along with Barnabas on the island where you know he's painting it looks all very very relaxed but then there's that kind of alarm bell and he realizes already that someone is looking for him.
18:37 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_03]: It's like who's this guy the poet that's sitting on his own with his talking dog?
18:41 --> 18:41 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh he seems very nice.
18:42 --> 18:43 [SPEAKER_03]: Oh hang out I can that's destruction.
18:44 --> 18:49 [SPEAKER_03]: And people are effectively being destroyed by this quest out to find destruction.
18:50 --> 18:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so first I guess first up we see Bernie Capex who's a twelve thousand-year-old lawyer.
18:55 --> 18:57 [SPEAKER_03]: You see the lawyers last forever, John.
18:57 --> 18:59 [SPEAKER_05]: They certainly do and a very old profession.
19:00 --> 19:05 [SPEAKER_05]: But he's very very old because he knew when mammoths walked the earth.
19:05 --> 19:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Unless they needed legal advice.
19:09 --> 19:14 [SPEAKER_05]: I guess then he hasn't been a lawyer for that long.
19:14 --> 19:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, yeah.
19:14 --> 19:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Remember Saber Tooth Tigers?
19:16 --> 19:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe there was a battle between Saber Tooth Tigers and Mammoth and one took the other course.
19:20 --> 19:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, always, yes.
19:22 --> 19:25 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, the mammoth just sunk in the big pool of tar.
19:26 --> 19:26 [SPEAKER_05]: Uh-huh.
19:26 --> 19:30 [SPEAKER_05]: As it was depicted in the children's books that I read.
19:30 --> 19:32 [SPEAKER_03]: This was Bernie Capex, watched on.
19:34 --> 19:36 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a really interesting little stat that they mentioned there.
19:36 --> 19:37 [SPEAKER_03]: I call it a stat, it's just a number.
19:38 --> 19:40 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a really interesting number that they mentioned there.
19:41 --> 19:47 [SPEAKER_03]: Over sixty people are walking the earth who remember, say, say, but two tigers, including Bernie Capex.
19:47 --> 19:49 [SPEAKER_03]: So that's a really interesting idea.
19:49 --> 19:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Again, we have the personification of deaths in this show, the person that goes and picks up each of the cells that's leaving the planet on the sixty of the mate there that haven't left the planet yet.
19:59 --> 20:00 [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah.
20:00 --> 20:06 [SPEAKER_05]: And but they we don't know of anything if these are all this I don't think we've met any previously.
20:06 --> 20:06 [SPEAKER_05]: I think we've met one.
20:06 --> 20:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
20:07 --> 20:07 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
20:07 --> 20:08 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't remember.
20:08 --> 20:09 [SPEAKER_05]: I've met Matt Hattie yet.
20:10 --> 20:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yes.
20:10 --> 20:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Matt Hattie.
20:11 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_05]: And season one.
20:12 --> 20:12 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
20:13 --> 20:14 [SPEAKER_05]: So she's one.
20:14 --> 20:14 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
20:14 --> 20:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, excellent stuff.
20:15 --> 20:19 [SPEAKER_05]: So we know of two and soon to be back down to one again.
20:19 --> 20:21 [SPEAKER_03]: It's very soon.
20:21 --> 20:22 [SPEAKER_03]: It's very quick.
20:22 --> 20:24 [SPEAKER_03]: It's basically all we get is a phone call for pretty co-packs.
20:25 --> 20:26 [SPEAKER_03]: Played here by Lenny Henry.
20:26 --> 20:28 [SPEAKER_03]: Just an interesting fact about Lenny Henry.
20:28 --> 20:29 [SPEAKER_03]: We've covered him here.
20:30 --> 20:34 [SPEAKER_03]: It was in the rags of power, but an interesting part of it is Lenny Henry was a writing partner of
20:35 --> 20:50 [SPEAKER_03]: of Neil Gaiman's, he was a lot of Neil Gaiman's ideas were bane stuff, Lanny Henry, so while Neil Gaiman wrote, he would talk to Lanny about some of the ideas he had, including for his book Anancy Boys, which focused on the Spider-Guard Anancy, and Lanny Henry starred in the
20:51 --> 20:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Amazon Prime adaptation of an MC Boys, which has completed filming, and has disappeared into the ether.
20:57 --> 21:00 [SPEAKER_03]: It's completed about a year and a half ago and we haven't heard anything about it since.
21:00 --> 21:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's not.
21:02 --> 21:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Not a clear what's going on there.
21:03 --> 21:05 [SPEAKER_03]: So nice to see that Lenny Henry in here.
21:05 --> 21:08 [SPEAKER_03]: He also has a voice role in the show as well.
21:08 --> 21:10 [SPEAKER_03]: He voices the massive
21:10 --> 21:15 [SPEAKER_03]: Kind of Saber II styler, the Tiger character that you see in the background of some episodes with Barbie.
21:16 --> 21:18 [SPEAKER_03]: He was in season one scene at the start of season two as well.
21:18 --> 21:23 [SPEAKER_03]: So he is coming in front of the camera here to play Bernie K. Pax.
21:23 --> 21:26 [SPEAKER_03]: For a very short moment where he takes a phone call and then... Yeah, who's his end?
21:27 --> 21:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, he's like he's killed off really quickly by this construction accident.
21:32 --> 21:38 [SPEAKER_05]: I like I like the usual sort of foil that they do here where he's like, oh, that was close.
21:38 --> 21:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Thinking that the and the skip that had fallen on him with all its contents, they just missed.
21:46 --> 21:51 [SPEAKER_05]: And then of course, death pops up to say, well, yeah.
21:51 --> 22:10 [SPEAKER_05]: not really and and he's kind of like despite being twelve thousand years old he's like oh not now he's like yeah as always you know in his early twenties and but we do see that he has a son and as delirium and dreamer informed that and
22:11 --> 22:14 [SPEAKER_05]: K-Pax has been killed and died in the accident.
22:15 --> 22:21 [SPEAKER_05]: Again, it's very suspicious to dream that this has happened given how long he has roamed the Earth for.
22:21 --> 22:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Absolutely.
22:24 --> 22:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Delirium is kind of like suggesting it's just coincidence.
22:28 --> 22:36 [SPEAKER_05]: At some point over that, twelve thousand years, he was bound to have the odds against him.
22:36 --> 22:38 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, yes, but it is exactly as death says.
22:38 --> 22:41 [SPEAKER_03]: And I think this has probably been on a lot of t-shirts over the years.
22:41 --> 22:43 [SPEAKER_03]: We're even a couple of tattoos here and there.
22:43 --> 22:47 [SPEAKER_03]: Death's line of everybody gets what they get, everybody's life.
22:48 --> 22:49 [SPEAKER_03]: It gets a lifetime.
22:49 --> 22:50 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's all I guess, just a lifetime.
22:51 --> 22:51 [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly.
22:52 --> 23:06 [SPEAKER_05]: I think as well, what before we move on to our second person on Delirium's list is that they are being showered round by Lord Farrahman, who's now called Farrahl's chauffeur services.
23:07 --> 23:20 [SPEAKER_05]: So both Delirium and Dream are being taken around state side by this concierge called Wanda to find these friends and acquaintances of destruction.
23:21 --> 23:37 [SPEAKER_05]: And this is really where then we come to the second part, and the second person on the list, which is this dancing woman in Philadelphia, and a god, the god of sex and war, Belly now known as Ishtar.
23:38 --> 23:39 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, yeah, absolutely.
23:40 --> 23:41 [SPEAKER_03]: What an interesting character.
23:41 --> 23:42 [SPEAKER_03]: We're getting the flashbacks to her.
23:43 --> 23:46 [SPEAKER_03]: The other big series are the big book American Gods John.
23:46 --> 23:47 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, the story of Ishtar.
23:48 --> 23:50 [SPEAKER_03]: This is absolutely where that concept was formulated.
23:51 --> 24:00 [SPEAKER_03]: This idea of a god that has no longer worshiped and is trying to gain worship by, you know, in this case, doing sexy dancing in a little brush.
24:00 --> 24:10 [SPEAKER_03]: So if I can get any kind of worship since everybody's forgotten that I'm a god, then I can continue to have some form of power is effectively the story here that we hear from Ishtar.
24:10 --> 24:12 [SPEAKER_03]: She's lost all of her parents because people have forgotten about it.
24:13 --> 24:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, absolutely.
24:14 --> 24:24 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, it is such a great concept this and I love the fact that she recognizes Dream immediately here.
24:25 --> 24:34 [SPEAKER_05]: It's all kind of frosty because what we find as destruction ended his relationship with Easter after the advice from Dream.
24:34 --> 24:35 [SPEAKER_05]: Also, you know,
24:37 --> 24:44 [SPEAKER_05]: While she gives her this warning that she could be in danger, she doesn't know where the destruction is.
24:48 --> 24:53 [SPEAKER_05]: She goes, I could sacrifice a black lamb, but there's not enough articles.
24:53 --> 24:53 [SPEAKER_05]: So there she says.
24:53 --> 24:54 [SPEAKER_05]: So I love that.
24:54 --> 25:04 [SPEAKER_05]: I love how it's this sort of fusion of old, new of, in a sense, almost desperation of trying to be relevant to this notion of trying to be relevant.
25:04 --> 25:09 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think that whole thing of American gods really was drawn out from this.
25:09 --> 25:15 [SPEAKER_05]: So this whole sequence with Ishtar is really, really good for me.
25:15 --> 25:23 [SPEAKER_05]: The other side of this though really like is we do find out more about their driver and concierge wonder who is a trans person.
25:24 --> 25:30 [SPEAKER_05]: I love how she describes her upbringing and family but ultimately
25:32 --> 25:43 [SPEAKER_05]: because of her conservative family, she had to run away after the hormone therapy, because I like the turn of frayacy, they didn't know what to do with someone like me.
25:44 --> 25:58 [SPEAKER_05]: And she would want to connect with her family, but ultimately the decision she's made is that, well, until they accept me, and actually the one thing I do miss is her books.
25:58 --> 26:05 [SPEAKER_05]: but she will always be willing to come back to her family once they accept her.
26:05 --> 26:19 [SPEAKER_05]: I just think that it really the resilience, the resolution and the truth to oneself is just really, really good in this sort of further exploration of Wanda as this
26:19 --> 26:27 [SPEAKER_05]: And you know, in a sense, temporary or ultimately temporary sidekick to, and delirium and dream on their quest.
26:28 --> 26:31 [SPEAKER_05]: And it's short, but impactful and powerful.
26:31 --> 26:32 [SPEAKER_05]: I really, really enjoyed it.
26:32 --> 26:36 [SPEAKER_03]: It really stands out and played by Andy Amora from Pose.
26:36 --> 26:37 [SPEAKER_03]: We've absolutely loved the series of Pose.
26:38 --> 26:39 [SPEAKER_03]: She was such a central character in that show.
26:40 --> 26:44 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm just having these moments that the character of Wanda is a different character in the comic books.
26:45 --> 26:47 [SPEAKER_03]: She actually forms part of a game of view.
26:47 --> 26:50 [SPEAKER_03]: She's one of Barbie's new roommates we saw Barbie in the doll house.
26:50 --> 26:54 [SPEAKER_03]: So she's one of the new Hadesmates of Barbie when we meet her again in the show.
26:55 --> 27:02 [SPEAKER_03]: But the storyline of the character of Wanda is similar to what we see in the series in season two.
27:02 --> 27:03 [SPEAKER_03]: Wanda is a real side character.
27:03 --> 27:07 [SPEAKER_03]: They could have left her a completely in the show and glad they didn't leave her age because
27:07 --> 27:08 [SPEAKER_03]: It's such an important story.
27:08 --> 27:11 [SPEAKER_03]: It's one that was burned into my memory when I read it back in the early nineties.
27:11 --> 27:13 [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm glad they've updated it.
27:13 --> 27:18 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm glad they've brought in an actress as good as Indiamore to play the character of Wanda.
27:19 --> 27:26 [SPEAKER_03]: And it is a really sad moment when we get to the end of the episode and it stars doing her dance for the audience in the club here.
27:27 --> 27:33 [SPEAKER_03]: And she explodes taking out herself and Wanda as well, killing everybody in the club.
27:34 --> 27:36 [SPEAKER_03]: And you see how much it impacts to the area as well.
27:36 --> 27:37 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, definitely.
27:37 --> 27:42 [SPEAKER_05]: And I think also like Ishto is played by Amber Rose Reaver and she was in the Punisher.
27:42 --> 27:49 [SPEAKER_05]: I just really like as well her in these scenes, you know.
27:51 --> 27:53 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, clearly doesn't have a good relationship with dream.
27:54 --> 27:59 [SPEAKER_05]: She goes, what have I done that you hate me so you've killed me by coming here.
28:00 --> 28:04 [SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, if I die site, I will do so as a goddess.
28:04 --> 28:08 [SPEAKER_05]: And if I survive, I'll do my best to live as one from now on.
28:08 --> 28:14 [SPEAKER_05]: And I mean, that dance just before the explosion, I just found very, very cool.
28:14 --> 28:15 [SPEAKER_05]: That's that bad.
28:15 --> 28:18 [SPEAKER_05]: It's not hypnotic element to it.
28:19 --> 28:34 [SPEAKER_05]: They've never seen me truly dance before and it's such a great dance and sing the end the audience that then just become mesmerised and hypnotised by this goddess doing what goddesses do and survive.
28:34 --> 28:40 [SPEAKER_05]: And in the sense, I almost, it's just the parallel with Wanda and Ishtar and that I really really enjoy here.
28:41 --> 28:44 [SPEAKER_03]: And so, so much the great character, yeah, really enjoyed them.
28:45 --> 28:46 [SPEAKER_03]: And that brings us to the end of the episode.
28:46 --> 28:53 [SPEAKER_03]: The final moment really is at the end of the episode when Desire arrives at the club after everybody is dead.
28:54 --> 28:57 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, they've all, they all have their moment of desire, I guess, for Ishtar.
28:58 --> 29:00 [SPEAKER_03]: And so that's what brings Desire there.
29:00 --> 29:02 [SPEAKER_03]: And she kind of drops a hint.
29:02 --> 29:06 [SPEAKER_03]: That dreams not in it for the trip to destruction.
29:08 --> 29:13 [SPEAKER_03]: That he may have felt the delirium will just disappear at some point, but on the journey he wanted to go out and find Nada.
29:14 --> 29:14 [SPEAKER_03]: That's it.
29:15 --> 29:23 [SPEAKER_05]: No, absolutely, but I mean, again, that tension boils over between desire and dream, because she does, she tells Delirium exactly.
29:25 --> 29:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Why dream is with her, because dream sort of snaps at her arriving, looking on that this destruction that has been caused, in essence, as Esther says, by dream coming here tonight, if he didn't do that,
29:43 --> 30:03 [SPEAKER_05]: all those people would be alive and it's star the goddess and wonder and so it's him as well you know I put in brackets delirium but desires fury is aimed at dreams you know where she says don't lecture me I'm done with you and effectively
30:03 --> 30:15 [SPEAKER_05]: informs to Lerium of dreams true intentions for going with her to find destruction, which is not to find destruction, but not as we said before.
30:15 --> 30:26 [SPEAKER_05]: I really liked how this kind of butting of heads between desire and dream always happens and the other thing I really liked is just how to Lerium leaves with the
30:28 --> 30:33 [SPEAKER_05]: the sort of mirror glass realm breaking into her realm.
30:33 --> 30:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
30:33 --> 30:36 [SPEAKER_05]: The fact that glass is just very cool effect.
30:36 --> 30:37 [SPEAKER_03]: And there's a really love that.
30:38 --> 30:45 [SPEAKER_03]: There's a little moments where we see the endless leaving to go back to their realms and always love those very, really cool moments.
30:47 --> 30:54 [SPEAKER_03]: I know the metaphor is a little heavy-handed, but I still kind of like the idea that you're looking for destruction when you find destruction.
30:54 --> 30:54 [SPEAKER_03]: Right?
30:54 --> 30:55 [SPEAKER_03]: That's kind of what's happened here, right?
30:56 --> 30:59 [SPEAKER_03]: So that's definitely their in capital letters.
30:59 --> 31:01 [SPEAKER_03]: That's what you're saying.
31:02 --> 31:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, okay.
31:02 --> 31:04 [SPEAKER_03]: You're looking for the dishonest location of destruction.
31:04 --> 31:08 [SPEAKER_03]: You're actual brother, but look as being destroyed on your path to find in him.
31:08 --> 31:28 [SPEAKER_03]: It's kind of it's there in in strong text overall And that's it for this episode for episode four I just wanted to mention that note I might mention already that that one that was a different character in the comic books the character in the comics is Ruby Delong who was the driver and died slightly differently Did I did also die in a fire in the comics as well?
31:29 --> 31:36 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm dropped a cigarette while she was sleeping Yeah, but also at other character dying on this path to to find destruction so yeah
31:37 --> 31:42 [SPEAKER_03]: Good stuff, you can't show tobacco smoking and moving TV shows anymore, so that's the good type of death.
31:44 --> 31:45 [SPEAKER_03]: I thought you could.
31:45 --> 31:47 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, it seems to have come back.
31:47 --> 31:48 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe in movies.
31:48 --> 31:49 [SPEAKER_03]: You can't.
31:49 --> 31:51 [SPEAKER_03]: I think I think a bunch of children's programs.
31:51 --> 31:52 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, no.
31:52 --> 31:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I know in our day, you could definitely show smoking and children's programs.
31:55 --> 31:58 [SPEAKER_03]: You could probably show the children smoking and children's programs when we were young.
31:59 --> 31:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, yeah.
31:59 --> 32:01 [SPEAKER_03]: But now comes up with tobacco depictions.
32:01 --> 32:04 [SPEAKER_03]: They're not paid for that kind of thing.
32:04 --> 32:06 [SPEAKER_03]: There actually might have been a few people smoking in the club.
32:07 --> 32:09 [SPEAKER_03]: They're certainly where by the end of the episode.
32:09 --> 32:10 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, definitely.
32:11 --> 32:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Excellent stuff, Derek, what do you think of a Sandman season two chapter four?
32:16 --> 32:17 [SPEAKER_05]: Brief lives.
32:18 --> 32:20 [SPEAKER_03]: apart from my tasteless joke at the end there.
32:21 --> 32:24 [SPEAKER_03]: I did really like this episode as a set up for this arc.
32:24 --> 32:26 [SPEAKER_03]: I instantly wanted to go on to episode five.
32:27 --> 32:29 [SPEAKER_03]: I wanted to see how this continued.
32:30 --> 32:39 [SPEAKER_03]: It's a sad way that the episode ends with the death of Wanda, the death of the star and the breakup of Delirium and Dream.
32:39 --> 32:42 [SPEAKER_03]: So knowing that the story will continue in the next episode, at least
32:43 --> 32:50 [SPEAKER_03]: didn't make it as bad for me, but I really enjoyed this setup for the beginning of the journey to search for destruction.
32:50 --> 33:02 [SPEAKER_03]: And also, we didn't really talk about it here because we've now watched the episodes a couple of weeks ago, a couple of weeks ago, and said the big reveal in the episode here of who the last sibling is of destruction.
33:02 --> 33:06 [SPEAKER_03]: What did you think of that, John, when you first heard that that was the final member of the endless destruction?
33:07 --> 33:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm really, really happy to find that out.
33:11 --> 33:20 [SPEAKER_05]: And yes, the path to destruction is laid with destruction essentially, a little laid to waste effectively.
33:20 --> 33:23 [SPEAKER_05]: And I like how that is how it plays out here.
33:23 --> 33:26 [SPEAKER_05]: So I really enjoyed finding out that it was destruction.
33:27 --> 33:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I mean, I really, really enjoyed this episode.
33:29 --> 33:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Give it four and a half desirie potatoes, and it was for five.
33:36 --> 33:37 [SPEAKER_05]: That's an interesting ratio.
33:38 --> 33:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, all you could pronounce it desire potatoes and which maybe I do and quite like a good spurred quite frankly.
33:47 --> 33:48 [SPEAKER_05]: That's why you moved to Ireland.
33:48 --> 33:50 [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly, exactly.
33:51 --> 33:53 [SPEAKER_05]: Spurred's in Guinness, yeah, and spoke sound.
33:55 --> 33:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Excellent.
33:56 --> 33:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Your husband, John.
33:58 --> 33:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Of course I did.
33:59 --> 34:01 [SPEAKER_05]: Let me know it at the time.
34:01 --> 34:01 [SPEAKER_03]: True.
34:01 --> 34:02 [SPEAKER_03]: You knew you'd find those.
34:02 --> 34:07 [SPEAKER_05]: I set off on my journey for potatoes, smoked salmon, and Guinness.
34:07 --> 34:08 [SPEAKER_05]: And famed love instead.
34:08 --> 34:09 [SPEAKER_05]: And famed love instead.
34:09 --> 34:10 [SPEAKER_05]: I was well.
34:10 --> 34:11 [SPEAKER_05]: And as well.
34:12 --> 34:21 [SPEAKER_05]: And I do, I like this whole kind of mission quest here of delirium, roping in dream, even though he's lying to her.
34:21 --> 34:31 [SPEAKER_05]: I love that desire is actually, you know, more and more shining the light on dream as just this snottie.
34:32 --> 34:37 [SPEAKER_05]: So slightly hypocritical member of the endless.
34:39 --> 34:50 [SPEAKER_05]: I really enjoyed sort of, I think the K-Pax was, you know, maybe a little harshly or briefly treated, as should I say.
34:51 --> 34:55 [SPEAKER_05]: What I love getting into Ishaia, it just felt of American gods.
34:55 --> 35:05 [SPEAKER_05]: I love that book and love that show and I really like this little element of that here in the Sandman and I think Ishaia along with Wanda and just
35:07 --> 35:17 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, being snuffed out by instructions, a drying pool and it's early warning system is just really sad.
35:17 --> 35:26 [SPEAKER_05]: But it is touching and I really enjoyed this, this whole moment between I start and dream, dream,
35:27 --> 35:34 [SPEAKER_05]: delirium and wonder, dream delirium and desire on ultimately with delirium leaving.
35:34 --> 35:40 [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, for me, for and a half, desiri potatoes and it's a five fantastic fantastic.
35:41 --> 35:42 [SPEAKER_03]: Could have said golden wonder.
35:42 --> 35:45 [SPEAKER_03]: You could have said golden wonder that would have made it even less sense.
35:45 --> 35:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Great stuff, nearest pike.
35:47 --> 35:50 [SPEAKER_03]: We do have some feedback in from some of our wonderful fellow dreamers.
35:51 --> 36:01 [SPEAKER_03]: If you want to send any thoughts on this season of the San Man you can email us to feedback at tvpodcastindustries.com or pop on over to our Facebook group at facebook.com slash group slash tvpodcastindustries.
36:01 --> 36:06 [SPEAKER_03]: There's a spoiler post up there for all ten episodes of the season of the, of the Sandman.
36:06 --> 36:08 [SPEAKER_03]: So you can leave your thoughts up on there.
36:08 --> 36:15 [SPEAKER_03]: First off, we have some feedback in on episode three from Lara, Willie Swink, who says, I am listening to the keys of Hell podcast that you did right now.
36:15 --> 36:18 [SPEAKER_03]: I'm trying to catch up certain sense of feedback in by the end of the season.
36:18 --> 36:26 [SPEAKER_03]: I agree with you though, that the show really should have shown Duma and Ramiles reactions to being sentenced to Hell as its eternal wardens.
36:26 --> 36:32 [SPEAKER_03]: A little spoiler for the comic books, but I wanted to put this in from Lara because I wanted a bit of a chat with you Jon about it.
36:33 --> 36:44 [SPEAKER_03]: Lara says, I also wish they could have added in the bit about how now when they torture souls will be because they love them, not at a spice or malevolence, and the souls of hell crying out that this made it so much worse.
36:44 --> 36:50 [SPEAKER_03]: Also, I think when Nullora moves to fairy glamour, you notice that she had almost an Instagram-like soft filter around her face.
36:51 --> 36:55 [SPEAKER_03]: To me, they felt like a commentary around people using online filters to enhance their features.
36:55 --> 37:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Personally, I was really hoping for her scrappy, wavy, pixie-like appearance from the comics, and was a bit disappointed to not get it.
37:02 --> 37:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Overall, though, really enjoying the show and your podcasts.
37:05 --> 37:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Excellent stuff, thanks Lara.
37:08 --> 37:11 [SPEAKER_05]: And yet, no, the glamour thing was a bit weird.
37:11 --> 37:14 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, you do expect an old crowed underneath.
37:14 --> 37:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and like a very grown going on.
37:19 --> 37:31 [SPEAKER_03]: I feel like if you're watching on your phone, a lot of people watch Netflix shows for some reason on their phone, you absolutely don't notice that the filter is gone, but it's a really good point that Lara makes that it is just like an Instagram filter dropping.
37:31 --> 37:32 [SPEAKER_03]: It's no major difference.
37:32 --> 37:37 [SPEAKER_03]: She still looks beautiful, but she doesn't have that shimmery aura around her that people
37:37 --> 37:40 [SPEAKER_03]: would use a little part of English accent or a part of English accent.
37:40 --> 37:41 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, you got her Irish accent back.
37:41 --> 37:42 [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly.
37:43 --> 37:44 [SPEAKER_03]: But it is a bit different.
37:44 --> 37:45 [SPEAKER_03]: She looks like a very different character.
37:46 --> 37:54 [SPEAKER_03]: The artwork that's there for that particular issue of Nula once she drops the glamour is a completely different artwork than you've seen for the previous for the previous pages.
37:54 --> 37:54 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
37:54 --> 37:56 [SPEAKER_03]: It was not written above her head that that's Nula.
37:56 --> 37:57 [SPEAKER_03]: You wouldn't know.
37:58 --> 37:59 [SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah.
37:59 --> 38:12 [SPEAKER_03]: And as for the moment with Duman Ramayal, when they realize they're going to be the new wardens that line, that's in the comfort of that moment, that's in the comfort book where they say, you know, we're not here as a spice or malevolence.
38:12 --> 38:15 [SPEAKER_03]: We're going to punish you because we love you and we feed you.
38:16 --> 38:17 [SPEAKER_03]: You'd want to be treated this way.
38:17 --> 38:18 [SPEAKER_03]: We love you.
38:18 --> 38:22 [SPEAKER_03]: We should get you back to heaven kind of thing and the souls of hell going.
38:22 --> 38:25 [SPEAKER_03]: That's way worse than it's malevolent demon.
38:25 --> 38:25 [SPEAKER_03]: I love that.
38:26 --> 38:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and certainly within the context of what Lucifer says around why people ultimately end up in hell because they're massacists.
38:34 --> 38:35 [SPEAKER_05]: They want this.
38:36 --> 38:40 [SPEAKER_05]: They're looking for this and you know whether living or now in death.
38:41 --> 38:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly.
38:41 --> 38:47 [SPEAKER_05]: And they still just want this massacist tendencies to be sort of born out.
38:47 --> 38:48 [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, absolutely.
38:48 --> 38:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, no, but even then it'd be like Duma and Romeo's
38:54 --> 39:02 [SPEAKER_05]: torture, you know, maybe they do it with a feather on the feet or something like that or like sort of tickle.
39:02 --> 39:06 [SPEAKER_03]: You would think, but no, they punish them just as brutally as the demons of hell do.
39:06 --> 39:06 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
39:06 --> 39:07 [SPEAKER_03]: That's saying yeah.
39:10 --> 39:10 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
39:11 --> 39:12 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it does sound much worse.
39:12 --> 39:13 [SPEAKER_03]: That sounds like a serial killer.
39:13 --> 39:14 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, absolutely.
39:14 --> 39:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, nightmare.
39:16 --> 39:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Excellent stuff.
39:17 --> 39:19 [SPEAKER_05]: Um, like so much lower.
39:19 --> 39:20 [SPEAKER_05]: Thanks Lara.
39:20 --> 39:20 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
39:20 --> 39:27 [SPEAKER_05]: We also got some feedback from Coffee and vodka who says greetings, fellow destruction, seeking defenders.
39:27 --> 39:34 [SPEAKER_05]: Even knowing the wires of the truncated season and series, I missed those details, which would otherwise have been present.
39:35 --> 39:47 [SPEAKER_05]: The consequences of stepping off the path in Dream's Castle and seeing Farrell all tiffily among them, but I have to admit, the forced plot speed has made for a tighter, more efficient run.
39:47 --> 39:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Still, wonder we barely knew, but if it took the sacrifice of half your appearances to bring in Barnabas, then so be it.
39:55 --> 40:00 [SPEAKER_05]: This being a bridging episode, not a lot to say otherwise, other than so far, so good.
40:01 --> 40:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Three and a half scrying fools, trying siblings and flashbang dances out of five.
40:07 --> 40:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Peace and take care.
40:09 --> 40:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Coffee and vodka.
40:10 --> 40:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Flashbang dances.
40:11 --> 40:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Hmm, not four and a half to zeroy potatoes.
40:14 --> 40:14 [SPEAKER_05]: No.
40:14 --> 40:16 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe King Edward's even.
40:17 --> 40:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe.
40:18 --> 40:19 [SPEAKER_03]: I like scrying fools as well.
40:19 --> 40:19 [SPEAKER_03]: That's quite a good one.
40:20 --> 40:21 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, that is scrying fools.
40:22 --> 40:23 [SPEAKER_03]: Red rooster.
40:24 --> 40:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know why you're still doing this.
40:26 --> 40:28 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm trying to share with one of my potato knowledge.
40:28 --> 40:37 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, the first time the first time I met John's mom over twenty years ago, the first thing she asked me was what's my favorite type of potato because I came over from Ireland.
40:38 --> 40:41 [SPEAKER_03]: I had no idea there was like the white ones, I guess.
40:42 --> 40:43 [SPEAKER_03]: Garden potatoes, baby potatoes, maybe.
40:44 --> 40:44 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't really know.
40:45 --> 40:46 [SPEAKER_03]: Mashed was my eventual answer.
40:47 --> 40:48 [SPEAKER_03]: That was hilarious.
40:50 --> 41:01 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, there are a lot of things that are left out of the story and the meticulousness of how the entire comic book series put together couldn't possibly translate to the show.
41:01 --> 41:08 [SPEAKER_03]: So I suppose bringing in things like Wanda into the show here, merging over the character, I think that's a great idea if you're
41:09 --> 41:14 [SPEAKER_03]: If you're unable to bring in that story line, the problem won't at least are able to bring her in here, and yes, by and of us, what a good boy.
41:15 --> 41:16 [SPEAKER_03]: So nice to see you.
41:16 --> 41:16 [SPEAKER_03]: Now he is.
41:16 --> 41:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Barnabas is cool.
41:18 --> 41:20 [SPEAKER_05]: I love the different colored eyes as well.
41:20 --> 41:21 [SPEAKER_05]: So cute.
41:22 --> 41:22 [SPEAKER_05]: I hope he's real.
41:23 --> 41:24 [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I don't know these days.
41:26 --> 41:29 [SPEAKER_05]: But I kind of obviously him speaking isn't.
41:29 --> 41:29 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
41:29 --> 41:31 [SPEAKER_05]: The mouth movement isn't.
41:32 --> 41:33 [SPEAKER_05]: But I'd like to think that it's
41:34 --> 41:43 [SPEAKER_05]: a dog, you know, regular dog, because you can get dogs with different colored eyes and certainly scruffy moths like Barnabas.
41:43 --> 41:48 [SPEAKER_05]: So, I don't think Barnabas is somewhere in the ether.
41:48 --> 41:49 [SPEAKER_03]: We'll have to look it up.
41:49 --> 41:56 [SPEAKER_03]: I haven't really looked at the too much of the behind the scenes stuff, but we'll have to see if Barnabas is a real dog or an amazing CGI creation.
41:57 --> 42:02 [SPEAKER_03]: But honestly, I think I've written down the name Steve Cougar about fifteen times as a voice of Barnabas.
42:02 --> 42:07 [SPEAKER_03]: I keep forgetting every time that it's Steve Cougar.
42:08 --> 42:12 [SPEAKER_05]: You get the hint of Steve Cougar absolutely at certain points.
42:13 --> 42:14 [SPEAKER_05]: But I think he is
42:16 --> 42:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Also putting on a slight accent.
42:18 --> 42:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, yeah, he's a great actor.
42:19 --> 42:20 [SPEAKER_03]: Look at everyone.
42:20 --> 42:21 [SPEAKER_03]: He's not just Alan Partish.
42:21 --> 42:23 [SPEAKER_03]: We've seen loads of movies with the business.
42:23 --> 42:25 [SPEAKER_03]: He's been fantastic and loads and loads of movies.
42:25 --> 42:27 [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm twenty for our party people.
42:27 --> 42:28 [SPEAKER_03]: I agree.
42:28 --> 42:29 [SPEAKER_03]: Fantastic as well.
42:29 --> 42:37 [SPEAKER_03]: So I did, I just, I keep it in my head that Steve Cooke can so kind of cool that he's in there as well in the in this season of the salmon.
42:37 --> 42:43 [SPEAKER_03]: Finally, we do have some feedback in on Facebook over there from Dr. Bob Phillips, who says, destruction.
42:43 --> 42:46 [SPEAKER_03]: The missing sibling is named and is up to his name in this one.
42:47 --> 42:53 [SPEAKER_03]: Guest appearance for our fave, not hobos, Lenny Henry made me think that Laura would last a little longer and the road trip felt a little rushed to me.
42:54 --> 42:57 [SPEAKER_03]: Is this a longer tail than all that's been abbreviated here?
42:57 --> 42:59 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I suppose, Dr. Bob, thanks for your feedback.
43:00 --> 43:00 [SPEAKER_03]: I suppose,
43:01 --> 43:06 [SPEAKER_03]: It is slightly abbreviated here, but the story will continue in the next episode.
43:06 --> 43:09 [SPEAKER_03]: But no, there isn't any more of the lawyer.
43:10 --> 43:18 [SPEAKER_03]: Lenny Henry's got the guest appearance here really because he's in the show as a voice actor, so they had him get some makeup on and play the parts.
43:19 --> 43:23 [SPEAKER_03]: There is mention of this character, a little dish.
43:23 --> 43:29 [SPEAKER_03]: And again, mention of how many people are on earth are still walking the earth for many, many years.
43:29 --> 43:33 [SPEAKER_03]: That's something that is taken up and we may see that mention of the show.
43:33 --> 43:42 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know whether this character might even appear again in the show a little bit of stage that it moves backwards and forwards through time, doing flashbacks and flashroards and moving around.
43:43 --> 43:52 [SPEAKER_03]: So much that you don't know whether this is the only appearance you're going to get in the TV show of a character that appears for five seconds in an episode or whether we're going to have a whole episode dedicated to them later on this series.
43:52 --> 43:53 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't believe so.
43:53 --> 44:02 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know there's enough stories there, but particularly for this character, but yeah, it seems truncated because you think this is the end of the travel.
44:02 --> 44:05 [SPEAKER_03]: I hope nobody minds me saying that the story continues in the next.
44:05 --> 44:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I mean the journey continues absolutely and it's kind of
44:09 --> 44:14 [SPEAKER_05]: It's the speed of going through Delirium's list in an episode effectively.
44:14 --> 44:15 [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly.
44:15 --> 44:18 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, I guess I can see that point for sure.
44:18 --> 44:18 [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
44:18 --> 44:20 [SPEAKER_03]: But thanks so much for your feedback, I'm actually already.
44:20 --> 44:27 [SPEAKER_03]: If you want to say that your thoughts are email us to feedback at TV podcast industries, but that's it for this podcast, on episode four of Season Two.
44:27 --> 44:31 [SPEAKER_03]: We'll be back, of course, with the same man, two-of-five, the son of Orfius.
44:31 --> 44:32 [SPEAKER_03]: Next time.
44:32 --> 44:35 [SPEAKER_05]: There's a Greek mythology being incorporated in here.
44:35 --> 44:39 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, yes, yes, we've had a bit of Greek pathology over on the island of this week.
44:39 --> 44:46 [SPEAKER_04]: A bit of the Trojan War, a desis, and the Odyssey.
44:47 --> 44:48 [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, yes.
44:48 --> 44:53 [SPEAKER_05]: So it's been a really good trip down all those ancient classics.
44:53 --> 45:00 [SPEAKER_03]: It is, and if you want to hear that, of course, pop on over to our website at tvpodcastindustries.com, and listen to the Isabel Condapodcast as well.
45:00 --> 45:00 [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
45:00 --> 45:02 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's like so much of joining us.
45:02 --> 45:02 [SPEAKER_03]: We'll talk to you again next time.
45:03 --> 45:09 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, thank you so much for joining us and until next time for episode five.
45:09 --> 45:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Keep watching, keep listening, and of course, keep dreaming.
45:13 --> 45:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Bye.