Spider-Noir Episode 4 Review

SPIDER-NOIR EPISODE 4 REVIEW TRANSCRIPT

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[JOHN]: This is the defender's podcast on TV podcast industries, and we're here talking about Spider-Noir episode four, and the stake I'll never make again.

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[BEN REILLY]: Beautiful song, you wrote it?

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[CAT HARDY]: I did.

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[SILVERMANE]: We prefer the splashy our numbers.

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[SILVERMANE]: I thought we were celebrating.

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[CAT HARDY]: Killing people?

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[SILVERMANE]: A couple of rats.

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[SILVERMANE]: Who tried to put you in a hole.

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[SILVERMANE]: Reilly got you out of it.

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[CAT HARDY]: I'll drink to that.

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[CAT HARDY]: Any regrets on the fact you almost killed me for nothing tonight?

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[SILVERMANE]: Yeah, I don't dwell.

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[CAT HARDY]: Maybe you should start?

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[BEN REILLY]: Well, it's getting late.

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[SILVERMANE]: Ah, no, no chance.

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[SILVERMANE]: You and me are drinking tonight.

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[SILVERMANE]: Be a doll and grab as a bottle the yellow spot.

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[SILVERMANE]: Enjoy the spot whiskey.

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[SILVERMANE]: We're going up a notch.

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[JOHN]: Welcome back fellow defenders.

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[JOHN]: This is the defenders podcast on TV podcast industries and we're talking about episode four of this season of Spider Noah entitled and a stake I'll never make again.

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[JOHN]: I am one of your host John.

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[JOHN]: I am your other host Derek.

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[DEREK]: What's a mistake you'll never make again, John?

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[JOHN]: podcast.

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[DEREK]: After 11 years I know exactly it was a mistake.

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[DEREK]: Oh my god.

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[JOHN]: No, it's not a mistake of course.

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[JOHN]: It's not no I'm a fake.

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[JOHN]: I'm only joking.

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[JOHN]: I'm joking and probably that Let's say I'll never make again I have no regrets Well, I would say underestimating spider noir.

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[DEREK]: I won't make that mistake again live action spider man.

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[DEREK]: It's side of the Tom Holland spider man has been pretty awful So I assumed this was going to be bad and it isn't it's really good.

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[DEREK]: So that's a mistake.

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[DEREK]: I'll never make it again

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[JOHN]: Excellent stuff, yes.

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[JOHN]: Well, I think we are resolved then on what mistakes we'll never make again.

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[JOHN]: But before we get into our spoiler filled discussion and fellow defenders, you can subscribe to the podcast over on our website at tvpodcastindustries.com on any thwipping or swinging podcast capture of your choice now.

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[JOHN]: You can also leave us thoughts at feedback at tvpodcastindustries.com or over on our spoiler filled comments that our Facebook group just head on over to facebook.com forward slash groups forward slash tvpodcast industries.

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[JOHN]: We are also on Discord.

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[JOHN]: You'll be able to connect with us in the show notes and of course we love with all of this stuff to get your

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[JOHN]: thoughts, theories, and observations on everything to do with these episodes of Spider Nuar.

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[JOHN]: So I think with that fellow defenders, we can move on into our who did what were when, how and why.

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[JOHN]: Derek, what are some of the episode details?

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[DEREK]: Well, halfway through the series.

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[DEREK]: So I'll say it again.

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[DEREK]: The show we're going to have for the show is Oran Uziel, who was previously well known for his work with Lord and Miller.

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[DEREK]: On the 22 Jump Street franchise, John to Janau 24, Jump Street was announced this week.

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[DEREK]: They will all be coming back.

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[DEREK]: Excellent.

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[DEREK]: At 22 Jump Street was fantastic.

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[DEREK]: 21 Jump Street was great.

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[DEREK]: They've skipped 23 Jump Street because the story didn't seem like fun in those closing credits.

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[DEREK]: When they were doing 25, 27,

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[DEREK]: 152 jump street so they are doing 24 jump street next and I wonder if or in his yellow come back for a first in scripting jesus on that Excellent.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, we got a fun one.

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[JOHN]: Well, in fairness now he has taken something like multiple combat and at least the 2021 version of it

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[JOHN]: it was pretty good.

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[JOHN]: Like it's really difficult, I think, to make a sort of movie from such a property, I would have thought.

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[JOHN]: I mean, it's basically, unless you do it like rocky or something like that.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, yeah, like it's

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[DEREK]: He's just done some really good stuff and a great job here on Spiderman Noir, so let's see if he does return for all the top beds of the cast that are coming back for the next one.

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[DEREK]: But the episode was written by Tori Samson, the only episode of Spiderman Noir, she's written but she is a writer on Hunters and Citadel, both for Prime Video as well, so great to have her on board here for Spiderman Noir.

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[DEREK]: The episode was directed once again by Enzyka Stewart who directed episode three as well, which we spoke about last time.

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[DEREK]: Great stuff.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, John.

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[DEREK]: Do you want to tell us what they gave us with your synopsis force by the noir episode four?

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[JOHN]: Sure.

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[JOHN]: Howdy confirms Ben Riley's suspicion that she hired Addison to kill Sill the Main.

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[JOHN]: She reasoned that the club boss wouldn't let her live a happy life with Flint Marco after Silvermain murdered her first fiancé, but Flint is listening into their discussion, and seeing them almost kiss, he feels betrayed and decides to return to work for Silvermain.

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[JOHN]: As his first job, Silverman uses Marko to intimidate Mer Morris into backing off on his campaign ending prohibition.

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[JOHN]: Meanwhile, Robby and Janet interviewed Lonnie Lincoln at the office.

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[JOHN]: After careful investigation, they learned the powers he, Addison and Marko have come from experimentation on them when they were prisoners of war.

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[JOHN]: He didn't know much detail, but directs them to Dr. Faber, who has been helping them.

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[JOHN]: Ben and Kat spend the night at his place where he reveals that his fiance Ruby died from a criminal he caught seeking revenge.

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[JOHN]: They both leave separately after hearing a metahuman as attacking the diamond district.

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[JOHN]: Both believe it's Flint Marco.

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[JOHN]: But the meta-human is a criminal with the ability to absorb and release electricity.

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[JOHN]: Van arrives in his costume as the spider, and eventually defeats him by shutting off the power in the area to prevent him from storing any more electricity.

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[JOHN]: Once defeated, Man Morris uses the spider's victory to boost his re-election campaign.

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[JOHN]: Later that night, after observing the battle in the Diamond District, Cat returns to Ben's apartment, and reduces that he is the spider.

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[JOHN]: She throws herself out of the window and Ben uses his powers to save her before she kisses him.

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[DEREK]: Yes, kiss kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy, kissy,

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[DEREK]: I guess learning that's a her partner of many years that will not travel away with her makes her choose somebody else.

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[DEREK]: Pretty quick.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, I guess so.

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[JOHN]: It seems like he will he left without.

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[JOHN]: really saying anything.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, she's a femphate.

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[DEREK]: She certainly is.

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[JOHN]: But let's move from Pillow to post.

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[DEREK]: Well, yes, but she didn't love with the people.

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[DEREK]: She has she's definitely connecting with with Elban all the way throughout the series as well.

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[DEREK]: Actually she had him in reserve let's say flip marker was here was the lover that she wanted to spend the rest of her life with and he was there so it was flipped left Yes, it's her joke.

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[DEREK]: Okay, that's this.

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[JOHN]: Right, so let's get into our web shots Let's get into web shot number one

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[JOHN]: Kill a cat.

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[JOHN]: Yes.

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[JOHN]: So cat here actually does reveal her plot to murder and old Fimbabon.

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[JOHN]: Sulfing because ultimately, and he was involved in the murder of her previous husband fiancee

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[JOHN]: she just knew the controlling type.

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[JOHN]: You know, you have a great thing where he's sort of, we've seen where he's asking us to walk up and down in new different outfits and so on.

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[JOHN]: And like his prized stallion or something like that.

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[JOHN]: You know, really in that vein and, you know, he's

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[DEREK]: controls the club effectively controls her and well he certainly wants to and that's and that's basically the point that she's making you know she she did fall in love so when proposed to her and he was killed because she could possibly have left the club and left silver main behind so she knew he would never allow her to have a happy life with anybody so um so yeah so she kind of connects the data I think there was no doubt that cat was the one responsible but interesting to

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[DEREK]: Yeah, I know definitely is doing this because of what he did to her.

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[DEREK]: It's not just that she wanted to kill him.

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[DEREK]: It's that she murdered her ex fiance, you know.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, no, absolutely.

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[JOHN]: I mean, I think it's I think we had Ben's talk about how she's the

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[JOHN]: the folk room, the crucible that everything else has kind of happened from or off, and she's the one that pulls this all together, and I do like the fact as well here that silver main as well.

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[JOHN]: as over at Kent Hardies the after what went down the night before and he's asking well why were you at the station?

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[JOHN]: Now she has a really good excuse for him I think it's really really plausible she goes well I was afraid you would kill me and you know Ben Riley was watching me for you so I was just afraid that you were going to kill me because the way you were behaving even though it wasn't anything to do with me but I just like the

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[JOHN]: You know, Silverman is in beauty with this in incessant suspicion and he's always going to be asking questions about loyalty about portrayal about, you know, whether he entrusted you on us and this comes back immediately Despite him thinking he or knowing that he's got the man who has

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[JOHN]: who was the rat in his organization.

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[DEREK]: Well exactly and and just to mention the big cliffhanger for next week, he shoot, he shows, he shot Gio who was Winston's right-hand man and I love the offer as a job to pin there that Ben saw it all that I didn't Ben's like well not really a father retirement plan in your organization.

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[JOHN]: There's great moments and yes as we were watching

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[JOHN]: the start about to get into the start of episode four.

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[JOHN]: I was like, yes, there was his and second in command, Winston's sidekick who had been following Ben Wright.

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[JOHN]: So that's when I kind of shouted Eureka might you re-commerment.

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[JOHN]: And luckily, uh,

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[JOHN]: Well, as it was Gio Winston's second in command, but yeah, no, I do like this notion of Silverman then trying to recruit Ben Riley into the organization to take on the role of Winston, but also we do get that next little moment in the whiskey watch as well

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[JOHN]: And so here we have Silverman saying we're going to, we're going up a notch tonight and we're going to get a bottle of yellow spots.

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[DEREK]: Yes, right.

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[JOHN]: So we had green spots.

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[JOHN]: We now have yellow spots.

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[JOHN]: I am wondering if they are going to refer to another spot in the next episode, potentially.

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[DEREK]: And what's a red spot like red spot?

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[JOHN]: Yes, so I think it'll be red-spot, but I am trying to think if there are any other colours in the spotted whiskey watch.

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[JOHN]: I feel like a bird watcher.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, we've gone from whiskey to spot watchers, what you're saying.

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[DEREK]: But in the spot whiskey's the red jello and green of the only three that are really well known You asked the question last time whether you weren't sure whether it would have been a rant back then It was originally formulated in the 1800s like he's in hundreds and became a a place where

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[DEREK]: Jamison would distill some of their whiskeys for multiple years.

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[DEREK]: So the spot whiskey is basically a green spot.

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[DEREK]: There's a whiskey that's been held for five years.

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[DEREK]: Yellow spots for ten years, red spots, I think for three years.

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[DEREK]: So that's the shortest one of the three I think it is.

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[DEREK]: Can't remember the order, but basically it's roughly that.

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[DEREK]: So Jamison would distill some of their whiskeys from sitting just directly to market and then they would give it to the spot company who would put it aside.

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[DEREK]: But

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[DEREK]: Yes, they have an interesting little notion on their website that prohibition was difficult for all manufacturers, but luckily Spot Whiskey continued and went through it.

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[DEREK]: So I think that's a little nod to maybe some of it was imported into the US.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, interesting.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, yeah.

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[DEREK]: It's a very vague peore state because it's almost like a holding house.

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[JOHN]: So it would be easier possibly to

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[JOHN]: Uh-huh.

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[JOHN]: Then I think it might be green.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, low red.

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[DEREK]: Oh, there you go.

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[DEREK]: So maybe there's red next week.

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[JOHN]: But I'm going off costs.

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[JOHN]: Mm-hmm But it's still tasty.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, it is my favorite Irish whiskey.

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[DEREK]: It is if anybody wants to get something for John for his for his big birthday coming up next year Yes, they save it up directs his this year, but he doesn't like another big fan whiskey.

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[DEREK]: No

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[JOHN]: But he'll get a nice big room.

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[JOHN]: The 80-year-old's room, maybe?

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[DEREK]: Something that's something from the parts of the Caribbean story.

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[JOHN]: From the bottom of the Caribbean.

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[DEREK]: There you go, there you go.

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[DEREK]: I think that's enough on Killer Cat Judd.

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[DEREK]: Let's get on to our website number two.

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[JOHN]: Yes, we have a Lonnie Lincoln hiding out in Harlem of all places, yeah.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, I like this.

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[JOHN]: You kind of have Robbie heading off to find and track down a Lonnie Lincoln.

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[JOHN]: I do like the fact that, you know, he's there with Janice at Ben's office and Ben arrives in very drunk and very hungover after said, yellow spot with ski.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, he comes in and not he's also need scrambled eggs and sausages, they call them links as well Some of the links, yeah, yeah, the ones that connected together that you have to cut apart with a knife or like just break yourself You're a sausage, yeah Yeah, I know it did the big difference to the U.S. that have sausage peppers

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[DEREK]: Hatties, which you really don't do over here.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, that's like sausage hamburger, basically.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, like you get McDonald's.

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[JOHN]: I think there is a square sausage in Scotland.

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[JOHN]: I can't really really famous.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, like there's a sausage patty.

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[JOHN]: Right.

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[JOHN]: And yeah, but I think it's squared off.

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[JOHN]: Yeah.

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[JOHN]: But it's quite famous.

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[JOHN]: I think it's quite...

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[JOHN]: Like, kippers are something that's going on for quite a while.

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[JOHN]: Right.

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[DEREK]: And the kippers, I think, you know, because kippers, the things in the ocean have been around for more than... No, I'm sorry.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm in smoke kippers.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I guess.

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[JOHN]: And it's kind of like that.

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[JOHN]: No, it's not something new.

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[JOHN]: It's just done them in that way.

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[JOHN]: Right, for ages.

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[JOHN]: I see.

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[DEREK]: Well John smoked me some kippers.

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[DEREK]: I'll be back for breakfast.

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[DEREK]: We'll get back to Lonnie.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, but just imagine yes.

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[DEREK]: So he's isn't he's in Harlem.

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[DEREK]: I think just it's interesting following on from the Hoover Vild last week that Lonnie then moves on to going to Harlem and in Harlem what we see when

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[DEREK]: Rob becomes into the town, is there a lot of poor people, a lot of people getting fed from the local community organizations?

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[DEREK]: That's where Lonnie's hiding, so he's moved from these kind of shanty towns into a whole area where, unfortunately, because the depression, lots of lots very, very poor people are living.

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[DEREK]: So luckily Ben's able to rudemage and they're able to take him back to discuss with him about where he got his powers, what was going on in France, and you know it took takes a long time for both Janus and Robby to get through to him to maybe say they are trustworthy people that can help him.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, I like this moment actually, two reasons, one, I think just a portrayal of, again, it's not just it's the depression, it's the depression coming off the fact that the veterans were picked up because they were needed for the war effort, huge amounts of people because of the nature of World War I that required lots of people to die in huge amounts for very little territory.

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[JOHN]: again towards the end of that war you know huge conscription for people to go over it's an opportunity in a lot of cases or seen as that just shows you how desperate people were even then and but it's also then

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[JOHN]: You know, the great war machine dumps you at the end of it, you're spat out, you're not required because the US doesn't need like most armies doesn't need or can't afford to hold a standing army at such a high personnel level.

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[JOHN]: So again, they're kind of let loose.

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[JOHN]: It's way before anything considered to be a welfare state, so it's not just the depression, it's the fact that they've taken time out.

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[JOHN]: They haven't stayed in the regular army and so they're having to find ways of surviving.

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[JOHN]: You know, they've given up to join the army.

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[JOHN]: Maybe giving up a job.

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[JOHN]: They may have done it to actually get out of the job, who knows if they were married.

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[JOHN]: Maybe their wife, fiancé, girlfriend, whatever, doesn't want anything to do with them anymore.

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[JOHN]: I mean, there's the PTSD element of it that no one would have talked about back and then, although, you know, it would have been called kind of warfever or, and

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[JOHN]: there would be different names for it.

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[JOHN]: So all of that controversy and I think that depiction here have just simply sort of the local community in Harlem helping out with a square meal once a day.

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[JOHN]: It is really good.

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[JOHN]: I think that kind of...

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[JOHN]: You know, you see the edginess then in Lonnie Lincoln, and it kind of makes an awful lot of sense plus he's gone through, you know, as we find out.

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[JOHN]: And these experiments that, you know, he was captured by the Germans, they did something.

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[JOHN]: to them.

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[JOHN]: But I do like that Janet there as well, slowly starts to make him feel at ease through a card game, just to give him that sort of...

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[JOHN]: other focus whilst he has conversation, kind of remove that anxiety, whatever, I just think it's a really nice touch and I like how it flows out with where he starts talking about the experimentations that what happened as well as then the person who's looking after them or they're going to at least for answers was in America.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, another key touch point to this kind of era in the US, you're talking about World War War I, which was even more than World War II for the Americans, was a very patriotic time to stand up and join the army and travel to battle.

19:17.749 --> 19:21.031
[DEREK]: world war with your allies against the enemy, right?

19:21.051 --> 19:23.672
[DEREK]: You know, the Americans joined World War II significantly later.

19:23.732 --> 19:29.215
[DEREK]: So, so there would have been a huge amount of Americans who were affected by it.

19:29.275 --> 19:34.638
[DEREK]: Not just people that went off to the war, you hear Janet saying all three of her brothers were in the army.

19:34.758 --> 19:37.220
[DEREK]: And you hear Robbie saying that his his were as well.

19:37.300 --> 19:37.480
[DEREK]: So,

19:38.100 --> 19:58.361
[DEREK]: Their conversation with Robbie here is saying look we've all been affected by we've heard before Ben was also over there You know, so everybody in this New York Society has had the effect of the war on them and now depression unfortunately as his New York quite specifically And everybody is feeling the effects of that as well.

19:58.442 --> 19:58.562
[DEREK]: So

19:59.102 --> 20:21.983
[DEREK]: They're bringing that community to the discussion what Robby, they're showing them that I know he's in a really bad way, but they've all experienced it to some level, so they're able to get him to talk about his experience, and he's saying that he's being helped by a doctor, Faber, Dr. Faber, who hopefully will meet later on in the season, who seems to have a lot more about the situation that's gone on with these super parrot individuals and where they got us, right?

20:22.003 --> 20:22.163
[JOHN]: Yeah.

20:22.343 --> 20:38.367
[JOHN]: Like Lonnie says, once it starts it gets worse, so it's almost like whatever has happened, however it's happened, it's gradually sort of taking over the genetics and the molecular level and the body.

20:38.607 --> 20:44.934
[DEREK]: Yeah and I think I mentioned that about the Sandman character in the comics and the other movies and TV shows and stuff.

20:45.474 --> 21:00.090
[DEREK]: Flint Marco is a character when he's just a low level bank rubber or shock rubber, he's okay, he's just doing it for money and but as the power of the Sandman seems to creep into him he gets more and more corrupted and more and more villainous.

21:00.470 --> 21:18.405
[DEREK]: And that's quite similar to what happened to Lani's character who became tombstone in the comic books and as I mentioned the last time the animated series, he starts out as just a normal, normal kid and as the creep of the power gets into his body, he becomes more and more villainous.

21:18.425 --> 21:25.891
[DEREK]: So interestingly, they're saying here that the way the superpowers take over, they take over completely and they lose their minds a bit.

21:26.011 --> 21:28.633
[DEREK]: So that seems to be what's happening with some of the other

21:29.774 --> 21:30.715
[DEREK]: in the digital scan.

21:30.755 --> 21:32.336
[JOHN]: Yeah, absolutely.

21:32.396 --> 21:37.000
[JOHN]: So we've kind of got that connection back now towards all one.

21:37.760 --> 21:42.504
[JOHN]: And the experience and we now have this name to latch on with Dr. Faber.

21:42.644 --> 21:48.348
[JOHN]: So you hopefully see them pop up in the next few episodes.

21:48.368 --> 21:49.609
[JOHN]: I'm hoping.

21:49.649 --> 21:51.730
[JOHN]: Have we got onto our webshot number three?

21:51.991 --> 21:52.451
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

21:54.973 --> 22:12.263
[DEREK]: Silver main chooses the man who were great scene and what a great part of this episode you know the the initial moments when Silver main is wasting he's left wasting for the chief of police to tear it up chief Matt Mara who doesn't tear it up for his appointment with Silver main I love that

22:12.823 --> 22:13.964
[JOHN]: I know you're so good on it.

22:14.024 --> 22:15.325
[JOHN]: It's tension with the knife.

22:15.365 --> 22:16.285
[DEREK]: It's something wrong here.

22:16.806 --> 22:32.895
[DEREK]: He has not been stood up very often and Silverman goes either in the search for the mayor and for the chief and finds the tools that them haven't dinner together, where Miramaris once again is choosing somebody else to stand up against Silverman.

22:33.516 --> 22:38.339
[DEREK]: Silverman is not happy about this at all and there's this great standoff between the two.

22:42.361 --> 23:05.247
[DEREK]: I was going to say driven away by overhearing what happened between Captain Ben but if you listen to what Lonnie said it sounds like his mind is starting to get taken over by that villain aside so he's now back working full-time as the right-hand man of Silverman and he walks into the room smash as the table won't fist a Russian front of the mayor out of the of the chief of police.

23:06.027 --> 23:09.131
[DEREK]: Interestingly, the chief police just kind of calls out, no, no, no, it's fine.

23:09.191 --> 23:09.951
[DEREK]: We're all friends here.

23:10.332 --> 23:11.253
[DEREK]: Just having a disagreement.

23:11.293 --> 23:11.713
[DEREK]: It's okay.

23:11.733 --> 23:12.374
[DEREK]: Don't worry about it.

23:13.575 --> 23:17.439
[DEREK]: And we hear the great line from Silvermain, May the best man live.

23:18.000 --> 23:19.441
[DEREK]: Yeah, no, absolutely.

23:19.461 --> 23:27.389
[DEREK]: Challenge him to control of the city because Silvermain has effectively chosen every mayor before Maris and expects that he'll choose every mayor after him.

23:27.449 --> 23:32.752
[JOHN]: Well, he wants, obviously it's Silverman, he wants Hudson as the next man, or Hudson as he says.

23:32.772 --> 23:36.575
[JOHN]: And I really like this face off this kind of test, I'll test.

23:36.675 --> 23:39.977
[JOHN]: And you can't remember between Maris and Silverman.

23:40.297 --> 23:45.641
[JOHN]: You have kind of Flint Marko lurking in the background just this present, which is really good.

23:45.821 --> 23:51.204
[JOHN]: And he kind of throws the first punch holes when he says, by sort of breaking the table.

23:52.245 --> 23:56.768
[JOHN]: But I also kind of, you know, you have the mayor saying, well, I'm not backing down.

23:57.129 --> 23:58.650
[JOHN]: Silverman's not going to back down.

23:58.750 --> 24:02.212
[JOHN]: So, like you say, the best man live.

24:02.593 --> 24:10.378
[JOHN]: But I do like Silverman's kind of one of his parting shots to Meryl Morris and says, well, you've got bulls Morris, I'll give you that.

24:10.799 --> 24:13.681
[JOHN]: And then you have Silverman saying, well, let's start it to win.

24:14.341 --> 24:17.424
[JOHN]: And yeah, I kind of just really enjoyed this.

24:17.464 --> 24:19.085
[JOHN]: I mean, I like also the fact that it was

24:19.685 --> 24:23.829
[JOHN]: Morris is up for this kind of confrontation with Silverman.

24:24.230 --> 24:34.720
[JOHN]: Chief McNamara clearly isn't he just wants a quiet life and I liked as well then, you know, the complication ultimately here

24:42.828 --> 24:45.129
[JOHN]: side of the election fight.

24:46.870 --> 24:53.014
[JOHN]: And so by right, ultimately, it's against Silverman, you would argue.

24:53.114 --> 25:04.841
[JOHN]: So that brings this nice confrontation of whether Flint is turning evil or not, he has now replaced himself to Silverman.

25:05.522 --> 25:08.303
[JOHN]: And is ready to fight for the boss, as he says, because Silverman

25:09.904 --> 25:13.928
[JOHN]: And so that's why he's pledged his allegiance and loyalty.

25:14.688 --> 25:19.453
[JOHN]: And so, it's more of that at least for the time being.

25:19.473 --> 25:20.433
[JOHN]: Yeah, absolutely.

25:20.514 --> 25:35.707
[JOHN]: And the fact that he did see, I mean, well, he won't know that Spider has been rightly clearly, but he's seen cat and then together, as you say, and then having their sort of very personal conversation about how, you know, silver main controls,

25:36.087 --> 26:01.286
[JOHN]: Kat Hardy, you know, says, what I were, who I see, what I do, and then you have her talking about her previous, if you want to say Thomas, a dentist who dated her, and bought a ring but killed by self-emain, and that was the, the concern would be repeated with Flint, and

26:02.247 --> 26:16.960
[JOHN]: you know Flint over here's all of this tail to Ben and clearly not impressed and not happy and that's what kind of sends him back into the arms of Silverman and seeing that intimacy between the two and that he, as he said,

26:17.781 --> 26:26.107
[JOHN]: it was a fantasy for me to think that we could have that and because of his condition, little does he know that Ben also has this condition.

26:26.127 --> 26:26.788
[JOHN]: Well, a condition.

26:26.808 --> 26:27.328
[DEREK]: Sublix owner.

26:27.408 --> 26:27.708
[DEREK]: Yeah.

26:27.749 --> 26:28.629
[DEREK]: Yeah.

26:28.669 --> 26:31.872
[DEREK]: But at least he goes back into the loving arms of self a man.

26:34.731 --> 26:35.511
[DEREK]: Okay, that's a loving.

26:35.651 --> 26:36.812
[JOHN]: I'm not so loving.

26:36.832 --> 26:37.212
[JOHN]: Certainly.

26:37.492 --> 26:38.473
[JOHN]: Very happy to see him.

26:38.493 --> 26:47.777
[JOHN]: Because Silverman does understand that these powers are hugely and commodities for him.

26:47.998 --> 26:49.118
[DEREK]: Yeah, absolutely.

26:49.198 --> 26:59.043
[DEREK]: It really feels right now like we are getting into the DC Universe, the Batman Universe, like where Gotham started back in its first season.

26:59.303 --> 27:11.574
[DEREK]: it was all about salmironi and the crime families and then suddenly as the super parrot individuals come up, either they start working for the crime bosses or they start taking over the crime families.

27:11.594 --> 27:15.657
[JOHN]: They realize their own value and it is more than these crime bosses.

27:16.418 --> 27:38.143
[DEREK]: who's going to step out as the as the penguin to take over from from from from self-remain here, you know, which of these super paraded individuals are going to step up to be the new crime boss, you know, I think I would say, can look look wise, I would say maybe tombstone would be the person that would that would lead these kind of groups and but we'll see how that goes as the season goes on.

27:38.163 --> 27:44.445
[DEREK]: Yeah, but what a really interesting idea here that we have self-remain going up against toe to toe against the mayor.

27:44.465 --> 27:45.205
[DEREK]: That seems to be the real

27:46.906 --> 28:02.223
[DEREK]: idea that we have here that the mayor does a one of these power and self-made believes he's the one that controls the power in the city So yeah, so cool little at total here Oh test or test yes, or test Indeed, shall we get on to our web shot number forward Eric?

28:02.283 --> 28:02.504
[JOHN]: Yes

28:04.655 --> 28:07.237
[DEREK]: Ooh, cause we haven't used super in tan.

28:07.337 --> 28:08.198
[DEREK]: We did.

28:08.218 --> 28:29.317
[DEREK]: Yeah, there was a really great bobbins where we had cast and a band that baked to kiss when Flint Marco was watching on and then the news radio interrupts with a brand new new story abase a super parrot individual down the diamond district and cast assumes it's Flint Marco and goes, oh, we gotta get down there right now and band also assumes it's Flint Marco and goes, no.

28:29.640 --> 28:30.600
[JOHN]: think for okay.

28:30.741 --> 28:42.927
[DEREK]: I think he's going to get down there as a spider because he probably needs to use his abilities not run down there as Ben Riley, but a little from a moment where there were back to kiss, it turns into a moment where the two of them kind of distrust each other.

28:43.147 --> 28:50.811
[DEREK]: So he's looking at Kak going, you're going to get in there for your ex-boyfriend and she's looking at him going, you're not going to get in there by my side.

28:50.831 --> 28:52.332
[DEREK]: We're just going to lazer

28:53.472 --> 29:02.020
[JOHN]: I do like as well, even for the audience, we all think it's Flintmark because we have so many having just said, let's start it to Flint.

29:02.620 --> 29:07.124
[JOHN]: And so you do think that it's Flint terrorizing this diamond district.

29:07.284 --> 29:12.248
[JOHN]: But yeah, ultimately it's not, it is electro, um, it is electro.

29:12.308 --> 29:13.750
[JOHN]: I really like this fight.

29:13.870 --> 29:19.074
[JOHN]: I love the use of the electricity from

29:20.215 --> 29:27.638
[JOHN]: Electro I like almost it's it's almost a bit like a drug and because he has to charge up To get the powers back.

29:27.738 --> 29:30.058
[JOHN]: Okay, so he's there charging back up.

29:30.218 --> 29:34.340
[JOHN]: It's like a battery John like a drug No, I didn't know but fit it's not Jill.

29:34.420 --> 29:37.221
[JOHN]: It is a battery, but it's more than that because he is

29:38.522 --> 29:41.544
[JOHN]: getting off on it.

29:41.564 --> 29:45.265
[JOHN]: He's loving it and he knows he's different when he's fully charged.

29:45.545 --> 29:53.709
[JOHN]: It becomes a drug and I just like how it like through the water, I like how he's using it against the spider here.

29:53.809 --> 30:01.913
[JOHN]: I just think this battle is really good because Ben Riley in that suit is having to work

30:06.627 --> 30:10.231
[JOHN]: this criminal effectively because he is souped up.

30:10.591 --> 30:27.309
[JOHN]: I like the fact that once he does eventually stop electro that you have Mermaris hijacking that moment, where he says we've teamed up to save the city and like you just have been riding on what now, you know, stop taking the photograph.

30:27.569 --> 30:37.158
[JOHN]: You know, so again and immediately pissing the spiser against Silverman here because of the association.

30:37.238 --> 30:46.286
[JOHN]: And it'll be interesting to see how Silverman deals with Ben Riley or what he says to Ben Riley about this in some of the upcoming episodes.

30:46.586 --> 30:49.569
[JOHN]: Let's just see how it plays out, but it's really intriguing for me.

30:50.830 --> 30:52.451
[JOHN]: And so yeah, I really enjoyed the

30:53.513 --> 30:57.738
[JOHN]: the little fight in the Diamond District between Electro and the Spider.

30:57.978 --> 30:58.819
[DEREK]: It was really good.

30:59.159 --> 31:02.884
[DEREK]: We haven't really seen a huge amount of the spider up against the villains.

31:02.924 --> 31:12.235
[DEREK]: We've seen a little bit of the spider up against Silverman's guise, but seeing Spider work out how to take out the guy with electric pirates.

31:12.295 --> 31:12.936
[DEREK]: That's really cool.

31:13.496 --> 31:28.469
[DEREK]: Again, having another one of the major supervillains from the Spider-Man can in here in Electro, you know, we've had Tombstone, Sandman, and now Electro, you know, where we're going to guess the Rhino and Green Goblin somehow merged in here in the future.

31:28.889 --> 31:34.354
[DEREK]: Silverman is another one of the Rogues Gallery for Spider-Man, but he has hundreds, so yeah, we guess.

31:34.634 --> 31:35.595
[DEREK]: Will we get more

31:40.018 --> 31:40.398
[JOHN]: probably.

31:40.418 --> 31:42.039
[JOHN]: I first see Doc Ock before.

31:42.059 --> 31:43.139
[DEREK]: Yeah, more of you.

31:43.199 --> 31:50.000
[DEREK]: Yeah, we were really funny if we had a guy arriving on a wooden cryptos maybe a duck or maybe duck favor.

31:50.080 --> 31:50.321
[DEREK]: Yeah.

31:50.341 --> 31:50.881
[DEREK]: Duck to octavefabre.

31:50.901 --> 32:09.285
[DEREK]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

32:10.605 --> 32:36.277
[DEREK]: they are connected now yeah the point is is like the only thing we need for them to be is metal not war or papyrus or tablets of stone it's just yeah in fact this whole show could actually be taking place in present day just in a different universe that's still set of the thirties are yeah it's happening but anyway it would be kind of cool to see even more of our bodies rogue scallery in there wouldn't

32:36.517 --> 32:39.539
[JOHN]: Yeah, I think it's a nice little rose gallery happening here.

32:39.699 --> 32:51.325
[DEREK]: But the fight itself really good for them, and it was a really long fight between Spider and the lecture, really enjoyed it as again, like Tim Workin'-H, how to take a match by taking all the power in the area.

32:51.765 --> 32:52.666
[DEREK]: That's what a cool idea.

32:53.246 --> 32:55.307
[DEREK]: And that's it for our penultimate point.

32:55.327 --> 32:56.228
[DEREK]: We'll be going to our fun.

32:56.328 --> 33:01.751
[JOHN]: I think so, we should head on, we should whip our way to webshot number five.

33:03.916 --> 33:10.058
[JOHN]: Yes, cat deduces Ben's secret and she does not have the only P.I.

33:10.438 --> 33:11.238
[DEREK]: No exactly.

33:11.258 --> 33:23.002
[JOHN]: She spots something in the fight with Electro where she can see that that is the actions of a Ben Riley and ultimately gets some kind of verification of that because

33:25.323 --> 33:30.925
[JOHN]: after only being away from Ben Rye for what maybe an hour or two hours at most or something like that.

33:31.265 --> 33:36.827
[JOHN]: He now has huge amounts of bruises around his face and he says, well, I've walked into a door.

33:36.907 --> 33:37.727
[JOHN]: How many times?

33:38.127 --> 33:39.528
[JOHN]: Yeah, exactly.

33:39.548 --> 33:40.848
[JOHN]: So it's just really good.

33:41.408 --> 33:47.130
[JOHN]: And of course, she then tests out her theory with a little fall.

33:49.531 --> 33:51.133
[JOHN]: out of the the window.

33:51.313 --> 33:54.096
[DEREK]: Yeah, I was trying to think where I first remember this from.

33:54.697 --> 34:00.663
[DEREK]: This is very famously the lowest lane throwing yourself off a building.

34:00.783 --> 34:02.065
[DEREK]: So superman could save her.

34:02.125 --> 34:03.126
[DEREK]: I definitely remember that.

34:04.027 --> 34:10.734
[DEREK]: But I also remember Gwen Stacy falling off a building and Spider-Man trying to save her and

34:11.374 --> 34:25.588
[DEREK]: Oh, no, she was thrown off a bridge, sorry, by green green goblin, but I remember Spidey trying to save her and it killed her because he broke her back because he wasn't able to catch her properly with his webbing, so and cat was playing a dicey game, she may not have known it.

34:34.656 --> 34:36.379
[JOHN]: But she is ultimately proven right.

34:36.439 --> 34:40.825
[JOHN]: Yes, and as he does catch up with his thwipping web.

34:40.845 --> 34:44.230
[JOHN]: Yes, and so yeah, I think this is really interesting.

34:44.250 --> 34:47.775
[JOHN]: Yeah, because it always makes the question, doesn't it?

34:47.815 --> 34:50.018
[JOHN]: Well, if she works this out, who else has?

34:50.159 --> 34:50.659
[DEREK]: Well, I play.

34:50.699 --> 34:50.840
[DEREK]: Yeah.

34:51.360 --> 35:01.263
[JOHN]: Yep, I like that because and you know, despite how careful you might think you're being as a Spider-Man as some other superhero good or evil.

35:01.403 --> 35:06.244
[JOHN]: Yeah, there is always the and chance of it being found out.

35:06.344 --> 35:07.104
[DEREK]: Well, that would happen there.

35:07.124 --> 35:11.766
[DEREK]: And there's lots of people in his life that do actually know, you know, we know Janice seems to know Robby.

35:11.806 --> 35:12.366
[DEREK]: Robby knows.

35:12.406 --> 35:12.786
[DEREK]: Yeah.

35:13.006 --> 35:14.746
[DEREK]: So well, maybe Janice doesn't know.

35:14.786 --> 35:16.547
[DEREK]: We just feel she does because she's smart.

35:16.767 --> 35:23.514
[JOHN]: I think she knows as an association between the two of them, whether she knows that Ben Riley is the spider and not entirely sure.

35:23.574 --> 35:26.377
[JOHN]: I think I would have said yes she did.

35:26.457 --> 35:26.698
[DEREK]: Yeah.

35:27.705 --> 35:30.747
[JOHN]: from the conversations in episode one and two.

35:30.927 --> 35:31.167
[JOHN]: Yeah.

35:31.507 --> 35:38.011
[JOHN]: But just the way she talks about the spider when he's coming back and she says it to him in the first person.

35:38.451 --> 35:40.252
[JOHN]: So it's like, when are you coming back?

35:40.352 --> 35:41.253
[JOHN]: Yeah, I think.

35:41.353 --> 35:41.853
[JOHN]: So she does know.

35:42.073 --> 35:43.294
[JOHN]: So I think she does know.

35:43.394 --> 35:43.734
[DEREK]: Good.

35:43.974 --> 35:44.955
[DEREK]: Good.

35:45.255 --> 35:46.636
[DEREK]: But yes, a really interesting one.

35:46.676 --> 35:55.641
[DEREK]: And then as Cass is saved and brought up by Ben, we hear the nice to meet your Mr. Spider and then they actually do kiss to Closetia.

35:58.823 --> 36:00.004
[JOHN]: I know.

36:01.045 --> 36:02.166
[JOHN]: Tongues at dawn.

36:02.386 --> 36:03.207
[JOHN]: Yeah pretty much.

36:03.267 --> 36:03.867
[JOHN]: Basically.

36:04.828 --> 36:09.632
[DEREK]: After a bit of electron going on, must have been electric.

36:09.652 --> 36:10.152
[DEREK]: Must have been.

36:10.433 --> 36:11.574
[DEREK]: Yes.

36:11.674 --> 36:13.395
[DEREK]: I wasn't that shocking a moment, right?

36:13.535 --> 36:14.076
[DEREK]: No for the puns.

36:14.096 --> 36:14.816
[DEREK]: Yes.

36:15.056 --> 36:18.099
[DEREK]: Any notes about the episode journey when I'm answering, we have a talk to him.

36:18.159 --> 36:18.980
[DEREK]: No, it's not from me.

36:19.600 --> 36:20.661
[DEREK]: Yeah, quite about yourself.

36:20.701 --> 36:24.304
[DEREK]: No, pretty straightforward, but really good episode to really enjoy it.

36:25.165 --> 36:32.372
[DEREK]: There's just one great moment when Ben is talking to cast, just the mirage shot of the two of them speaking together.

36:32.412 --> 36:36.175
[DEREK]: I think it was really, really cool to watch on screen, really enjoyed that scene.

36:36.516 --> 36:39.819
[DEREK]: It's been some great directing moments throughout the series so far.

36:40.519 --> 36:43.021
[DEREK]: That's another one of those up there with the best.

36:43.702 --> 36:45.523
[DEREK]: Yes, that's stuff.

36:45.583 --> 36:50.865
[JOHN]: Derek, do you defend this episode of Spider-Newa episode four?

36:51.245 --> 36:51.726
[JOHN]: I'm a steak.

36:51.846 --> 36:53.126
[JOHN]: I'll never make a game.

36:53.146 --> 36:54.087
[DEREK]: Yeah, halfway through.

36:54.187 --> 36:54.847
[DEREK]: Love of the patient.

36:54.867 --> 36:55.527
[DEREK]: Love in the show.

36:55.968 --> 37:04.051
[DEREK]: Really enjoying what they're delivering here with this with this at coup PI detective show set in that in the 30s Marvel Universe.

37:04.592 --> 37:07.213
[DEREK]: And again, just that the addition of another

37:07.953 --> 37:15.976
[DEREK]: super-parad individual when you suspect it was going to be a sandman when you suspect it was going to be sandman and it turned out to be a lecture.

37:16.296 --> 37:17.777
[DEREK]: I'd love that when that's really cool.

37:18.177 --> 37:34.423
[DEREK]: It's the idea that you could have you know 50 other super-parad individuals out there, you know, there's lots of people in that photograph that were tested on a World War I, so it could have people all over the place that are Spider-Man's Rogues Gallery old calls by whatever this experimentation happened in World War I, so that's cool.

37:34.803 --> 37:39.027
[JOHN]: Yeah, and absolutely that picture may tell a thousand stories in the end.

37:39.267 --> 37:42.550
[DEREK]: How are you John, do you defend the fourth episode of Spone in the War?

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[JOHN]: Uh, yeah, I really do defend this episode, give it four Merrill Hong Kongs out of five.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, no, I think this is a really nice pacing given the end of episode 3.

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[JOHN]: I like how it kind of pulls it in a bit with a much more personal story, certainly for cat and Ben, and how it connects out to the likes of Flint, you know, just Flint sing,

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[JOHN]: Ben and Kat having that kind of personal moment in the theatre where she started off as she's telling her life story to him, you know, I think is really interesting.

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[JOHN]: I like that we have Lonnie's story here and just like really good aspect of knowing the era around

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[JOHN]: you know, the food kitchens in Harlem, Lonnie Binks, sort of, effectively suffering from PTSD, just not just because of World War I, but because of being a prisoner and because of ultimately the experimentation.

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[JOHN]: I like that Janice is the one to almost bring him out of his shell here, and so this is already good, and you know, we have mere Morris Binks sort of more fully

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[JOHN]: the flight with a lecture superb and I thought there was going to be probably more of a lecture not saying that there won't be but seemingly he has captures and probably off the table for the rest of the series and but ultimately that he's there no that's true and but I think we might have the sinister sex by the other the season we just need possibly yeah two more super prepared individuals added to the sinister

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[JOHN]: possibly yeah and then ultimately the great gamble from catch that luckily for her pays off with a thwit and a snorke from Ben Riley.

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[DEREK]: Excellent stuff.

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[JOHN]: So yeah for Merrill Hong Kong's out of five fantastic let's get on some thoughts from our fellow defenders John.

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[JOHN]: In D's yes first up we have an email from our defender

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[JOHN]: coffee and vodka, greetings, fellow lights out defenders, took in the first four episodes in black and white and looks like that's the best way to continue, so much better.

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[JOHN]: The pacing remains very much in the PI vein with all the in this case welcome tropes that come with it.

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[JOHN]: And outside of our femme fatale, changing her emotional ties as often as I close, the show remains entertaining.

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[JOHN]: Megawatt was fun, though I didn't know why they couldn't have gone with Electron.

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[JOHN]: No, but it's a small gripe.

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[JOHN]: Finally, the Gwen Stacey Amar's was nice and non-fately cute.

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[JOHN]: Looking forward to the Silverman investors, the mayor battle to come.

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[JOHN]: Four and a half plunging neckplowing to sloppy, slucky, shockfests and unwanted political alliances out of five.

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[JOHN]: Peace and take care, cup in vodka.

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[DEREK]: great stuff, coffee, okay, yeah, I caught lots of things that we caught.

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[DEREK]: Mega was instead of a lecture, that must be a very different Spidey member of the rogue's gallery there.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, I just, I mean, I didn't catch any name if I'm totally honest.

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[DEREK]: It's just a zoomed lecture because I just had to bring each other in the Spidey version.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, I must sort of call them Amper.

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[DEREK]: Well, no, I think, I think what Valkyrie Vodka is mentioning is that there is another villain with the comics called Mega Watch, who, I guess, has to repair himself constantly from the, from the local lighting.

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[DEREK]: Must have to check that before the next episode, coffee Valkyrie, nice little air catch.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, good catch.

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[DEREK]: Yeah.

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[DEREK]: As always, though, you're out of five, are seconds and no one plunging necklines is a great show.

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[DEREK]: Thank you.

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[JOHN]: Definitely definitely love it.

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[JOHN]: Oh, thanks coffee vodka.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, thanks coffee and vodka over on disco or Joe herbs says Can't move down from Flint surprisingly quickly.

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[JOHN]: Yes, indeed.

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[DEREK]: He did and cage cracking all his joints in that chair It was great.

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[DEREK]: It was yeah, that mobility is just that they're waiting for cat to arrive Just going oh, what a day need to crack only joints.

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[DEREK]: I know that feeling on a Friday evening

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[DEREK]: And Dr. Bob Phillips shares his thoughts.

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[DEREK]: He says cracking weaving of more of the detector noir tropes in this one, the shoe-signed cigarette guy, the repeat calls that lead to accidental shading, a secret knock and a drinking competition that the hero loses.

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[DEREK]: And I did like them choosing not to end on a cliff faller, both go straight in for the kiss.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, that was a nice change, that's it, Dr. Bob.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, absolutely.

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[JOHN]: The old drinking competition as well, really good.

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[DEREK]: I do like that he comes in waste.

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[DEREK]: That's the next day.

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[JOHN]: You just don't see that.

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[JOHN]: I mean, or I think the portrayal, even of itself, is quite trophy, but it's kind of how I feel.

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[DEREK]: behave if I've got a hangover, but yeah, very, very reminiscent of Marion Ravenwood in the Israel, the last arc in her drinking cup of tea.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, absolutely.

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[DEREK]: Where she has absolutely wasted, but doesn't show it, which is why she wins the competition.

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[DEREK]: Great stuff.

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[DEREK]: Thanks, Dr. Bob Futhot.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, thanks, Dr. Bob.

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[JOHN]: And thanks, Joe Herbst.

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[DEREK]: And if you want to send in your thoughts for any of the episodes, email us to feedback@tvpodcastindustries.com or pop on over to our Facebook group or to our Discord details, which are on the show notes right here, but we will be back next week with our chat about two more episodes of the show.

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[DEREK]: At next time we're talking about Spider-man for episode five betrayal.

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[JOHN]: Indeed, we are.

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[JOHN]: Keep your feedback coming in, fellow defenders.

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[JOHN]: We love to get your thoughts on each of these episodes.

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[JOHN]: But until next time, fellow defenders, keep watching, keep listening, and of course, keep defending.

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[DEREK]: Bye.

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[JOHN]: Bye.