Star Wars The Acolyte Season 1 Review

[00:00:00] This is the Star Wars podcast on TV podcast industries and we're here discussing Star Wars The Acolyte Season 1 episodes 1 to 8 And I felt I could never learn to call my negative emotions. My hatred of you, my grief over our mother.

[00:00:50] So I never became Jedi and I guess in the end you got what you wanted. Welcome back fellow Acolytes. Oh, I've always wanted to say that. This is TV podcast industry. This is the Star Wars podcast and we are taking a

[00:01:26] Sojourn back on season one of the acolyte from episodes 1 straight through to 8 and all thoughts On the season. I am one of your host John. I'm your host Derek and rounding out this trio of masters But they should be a rule of two. We'll see. I am Chris.

[00:01:50] We'll see how long you're into that last for Chris. By the end of it, it might be just two. Only Joe's in Chris is into nothing amazing. Yeah, no, it's not. Not today. We will see how this ends. Absolutely. Yeah, welcome back to the Star Wars Galaxy.

[00:02:06] Far far away and even further back in time. Absolutely. Miles back in time. The first live action old Republic. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. It is old joints old old light tabletek. Old Jedi robes. Yeah, everything's old. Absolutely. More uniform Jedi's. The Jedi's looked way more standard.

[00:02:29] Proper kind of like priest sort of standard robes. Yeah. Yeah. The one thing I was going to say is they added some color to the uniforms. They had under but those brown robes. Seriously? I was just like, come on. Give us a bit of gray.

[00:02:43] Give us a bit of black in there. You know, maybe a bit dash of white. Absolutely. But it's just like, it was just like guys. Not everything needs to be a brown robe. I understand Obi-Wan can Obi set it down.

[00:02:56] What's in tattooing and that was where we got her from. Yeah. Give me the color. But he was in a desert. He was in a desert. He was trying to blend in. Yeah, I know. Yes, that pink robe.

[00:03:08] Absolutely. But overall, I think that's kind of the point of the act like show and we're resetting this story, this tale of the Jedi because they are in power. They are effectively the police force for the galaxy.

[00:03:21] If seemingly, you know, so they are much more uniformed as you say. There's even some interesting touches on paddawans all have the same uniform and then when they move on to master, they get to change the uniform. They get to get

[00:03:32] that brown cloak as well. So there's a, there's a interesting touch in the background that I'm sure we probably would have gotten into if we were doing this. As we normally do a red podcast on

[00:03:41] one episode of the time, this time we're covering the entire season. We've mentioned before the reason for that is because the boys come out at the same time and we didn't have any capacity to

[00:03:49] cover both shows at the same time weekly. At the moment we've got a loss going on. So we are going to look back at the season of the act like and talk about some of your feedback that we got

[00:03:58] in on the final episode for the act like as well. Absolutely. And I for one will not be looking back in anger. There you go, there you go. That's a little bit of a little bit of a little bit.

[00:04:07] We just kick us off. Yes. But before we get into our spoiler filled review of season one of the act light. Please remember fellow act lights to pop on over to our website at tvpodcastindustries.com

[00:04:24] where you can subscribe to the podcast on any act light or paddawans podcast player of your choice. And you can also find our coverage of every episode of the bad batch over there. You can find

[00:04:36] our coverage of a soka, the live action series over there as well. And you can also get our coverage of this year's tales of the empire as well. Really good animated series with just eight episodes.

[00:04:48] So you can go to all of that. As well as the boys that we are covering during this period as well. Exactly. Of the old Republic. Yes, exactly. Exactly. And of course if you want to get

[00:05:02] in contact with us on any of the shows that we cover you can of course send your emails into feedback at tvpodcastindustries.com or you can join us over on our Facebook group at facebook.com

[00:05:16] for slash groups forward slash TV podcast industries absolutely yeah we do love for you to join us over there on the Facebook group. The sponsor post of pre-chaposite actually can go over there

[00:05:27] if you want to discuss individual episodes with all of the other fellow accolites chat about them over there and all the other shows that we're covering so you can chat about any of the shows

[00:05:35] after they've aired as well. Yes, but let us get into our spoiler filled discussion Derek who gave us what were when how and why for episodes one to eight because we're covering all the episodes

[00:05:47] just a lot here. So I'm just giving you the general facts about each of the people that are involved. The show we're at for the show is Leslie headvomged. I probably most well known as the co-creator

[00:05:57] of Russian doll in Netflix series with Natasha Leone at excellent two seasons of that show really really well worth a watch if you want to see something else outside of the Star Wars universe that

[00:06:06] Leslie had them involved in. But apparently she was asked the premiere of the Rise of Skywalker when she was first approached to take on a Star Wars series and her first idea that she came up with was

[00:06:15] I'd love to go into the older public and see the bad guys and see their side of things, their side of the tail so that all started off the idea of the afterlife that long ago.

[00:06:26] Excellent. Yeah, I think it's really good take actually. I know there was some fireworks of an older public. Yeah, video games which the adverts for them, the cinematic adverts for them

[00:06:40] were just incredible and then you got and then you got the game. No, no, so by a ways original Knights of the older public and one and two they were fantastic. Very old looking for dated now

[00:06:57] for back then they were amazing. Fantastic RPGs. There is the Star Wars, the older public, not the Knights of the Republic but the older public which is the MMO. Which is still going to this day

[00:07:09] no longer produced by a buyer where that do some of the best cinematic CGI based and there's one or two there's a whole date that these holding almost a movie and watch on YouTube. Yeah, it's brilliant.

[00:07:22] It's about two brothers and they're delighted and dark and all that. Fantastic and then there's the game on that one. Yeah, I would have creed the MMO and then there's the game but the original two RPGs

[00:07:35] for as an OG gamer back when Xbox came out and the older public came out. I was like this is the bomb. Yeah, I said this is the bomb. Yeah, yeah, I can't agree with you on that one

[00:07:50] of course. I get where you're coming from. Yeah, you can't play a game at that level of just gorgeousness cinematic. Yeah, boss. No, well maybe you can't. Yeah, like I would hope that there

[00:08:05] will be some inspiration kicking off now that we can set lots of things in the older public universe like in new games. You know, we don't have to always keep going back to the

[00:08:13] Scott Walker saga. And so hopefully we'll get more games of the quality of the Jedi Survivor and games that have that quality of graphics and that quality of gameplay set in the older public. I

[00:08:24] hope that's something that they do in the future. So really cool that Leslie Hadland went back to this year for her first Star Wars. Yeah, it's a really good choice. Yeah, thank you. Yeah,

[00:08:35] let's go through the directors for the show Leslie Hadland herself directed the first two episodes of the season for the show stamp, putting her stamp on the season. Kaganada, the director for the show, a Korean American director directed episode three and episode seven, Alex Garcia Lopez

[00:08:49] directed episodes four and five and previously he directed episode for the ponisher Daredevil Lukaage and the Witcher all the way which we've covered here on TV podcast industries. And finally he'll call pepper directed episode six and eight of the series previously directed two episodes

[00:09:02] of Gotham John and three episodes of Star Trek Picard again to other shows that we've covered here TV podcast industry. Yeah, it's always nice to see our kids echo action into the world and direct different shows that we're covering his name. Absolutely, I mean certainly for Hannel,

[00:09:16] Cole Pepper, you know Gotham is a good distance in the past a bit like we all Republic with regards to our podcasting 10 years ago. This stage where our team was. I think yes, the end of February 2014 indeed. Exactly. Exactly. The right of room for the show

[00:09:36] is stacked as well. Again, Leslie had along the show winner is leading up that writers room. Jasmine Florety as writers systemed on Falcon in the winter soldier and then moved on to become

[00:09:47] at one of the writers in the writers room in here. Corridana under the writers Charmaine de Grace it was a writer on Hats the Dragons season one as well. Jason McColle for the writer,

[00:09:55] Jocelyn Beow who is a writer on Russian Dull with the show winner, Claire Kichel who is a writer and story editor on the Watchman show that we covered here on the podcast.

[00:10:05] Jen Richards as well. I mean, Jim was a writer on Hats the Dragons season one and stayed on for season two as well and that's which is airing at the moment as well. And finally Cameron Squires

[00:10:15] is the final member of the writing room and he was a writer on story editor on one division. Cool. So look at the talent you got in here. You got Russian Dull from Netflix. You got Hats the Dragon

[00:10:26] the Excellent game of Thrones spin off Falcon and Winter Soldier in one division to great Marvel shows as well as Watchman one of the best comic book adaptations or comic book extended

[00:10:38] universe stories I guess. Yeah, that's it there. Great stuff. Really good stuff. So John do you want to tell us what they gave us in a Star Wars way with your synopsis of the Akalite season one? Sure.

[00:10:50] A long time ago in a galaxy far far away. Essentially before the rise of the galactic empire the Jedi Order and the Galactic Republic Basquean era of unprecedented peace. Yet darkness looms as Jedi Master in Dara falls victim to a mysterious assailant. Oshar and Asya a former

[00:11:12] Padua and turned Mecnic is wrongfully accused of the crime and pursued by Jedi Knight, Yord Fandar and his Padua Tacy Lowe. As fate intervenes Oshar discovers a shocking truth her presumed dead twin sister may is alive and the true culprit. Jedi Master's Sol Fenester

[00:11:35] Rower and Padua's Jackie Lahn and Yord embark on a perilous quest to unravel the conspiracy. Meanwhile, may under the influence of a shadowy master wagers a deadly game against the Jedi targeting masters, Torbin, Indara, Sol and the Wookie, Kelnaka. On the desolate planet of

[00:11:58] Bredock the origins of the twins are revealed tied to a coven of force wielding witches led by mother Anaseir, a faithful decision by Oshar to embrace the Jedi path, set in motion

[00:12:12] a chain of events that will shatter the galaxy. But as the hunt for may intensifies I fall in Jedi, known only as Crimea emerges as a formidable adversary. The fate of the Jedi Order hangs

[00:12:27] in the balance as the dark sides of the four-scroast stronger and new aerodorans filled with treachery, loss and the uncertain path of destiny. And Yorda, Indie spoilers. It is no wonder he said 800 years old you are good, you will not.

[00:12:52] He never looked good because he was a green kind of thing. I was watching it the second time that last episode I know we're skipping literally to the last second episode. I was watching it and going, I didn't even put a brand here too

[00:13:12] pay on him or anything like that. He still got Whispy Gray here from the pack and he doesn't even get the lines but he still got Whispy Gray here 100 years before him.

[00:13:19] It could have had a long flowing lock. I was expecting him to have a lot of them have that kind of ponytail with the actual metal bits. I was expecting him to have a white ponytail

[00:13:35] with Midstand, the back of his neck with his ear sticking out. Basically I was expecting that with a mohawk like this was Yorda during his punk year. Right. Or maybe a mullet in a moustache.

[00:13:48] Hey if you've got to go mullet he's going to go full boss on it. He's going to the boss the F1 driver. He's going in the Aussie style mullet, business upfront, party in the backyard.

[00:14:00] That is so awful. I was thinking maybe Ben would be doing kind of a Benjamin important thing where he was just taller. Maybe. But all I say when 700 years old you are Chris maybe you won't be going through your punk phase at that stage.

[00:14:17] Maybe 800 is the limit. 700. That's the midlife crisis moment. He bought a Porsche. He has a couple of them in a fair who knows what he's going through. Right. This is midlife crisis Yorda.

[00:14:33] So we've literally talked more about Yorda than we have about the series on these in for two seconds or actually. Yeah. Exactly. So let's get into our discussion about the accolite.

[00:14:45] Where do you guys want to start? Where do you want to kick it off? Do I give an impression of what you're overall feeling on the series is? Do I keep that towards the end as we talk about

[00:14:53] some of the big pushes that happen in the series? What would you want to start with? I'd be good to have just kind of overall thoughts on it. Okay. All of you, Dave. I enjoyed the show at the end of the series by the end of the series.

[00:15:11] I would think my biggest challenge with this show is setting a conspiracy show in the Star Wars universe is not doing the show runner or Star Wars as a whole any favors. Because Star Wars

[00:15:23] fans are right there and they want clues. They want to be able to talk to be told things that only they'll know that they've been so invested in Star Wars for 40 years that they want to

[00:15:34] be the ones that go well, I know that character is and I know that character is. There are only three characters including Yoda that have ever appeared outside of the show. Master Vanessa has

[00:15:46] appeared in one novel we have Yoda and we have Darth Play guess who appeared in the background in the final episode. So there's the only three characters that appeared at everything else

[00:15:55] is brand new for this show. If you do that it really is the show weekly. The Star Wars fans are going to attack you for changing things and by the end of the series everything that was complained

[00:16:05] to the show by fans watching the show had been resolved. But of course that is not going to do yourself to a massive fandom like Star Wars and I'm not saying you can't do different things

[00:16:15] in the Star Wars universe but doing it has a massive risk attached to it so I don't know whether this was the best show set in the older public that they could have done to kick things off.

[00:16:26] But by the end of the series that it resolved into a show I actually did enjoy. I like the idea of a bush when you're trying to keep information back from an audience to have a big reveal at the end.

[00:16:38] I don't know whether that was managed very well for my expectations week to week. I don't know if there will be a stock with it. In fact, to be honest if it was a completely different

[00:16:45] show like for example if this was like that crappy rebel moon movie that was based off a Star Wars script that's a Zack Snyder did. I didn't get through half an era that movie because I wasn't

[00:16:55] invested in the Star Wars universe so the universe that he was trying to build. So I don't know whether I would have stayed with Akalai, if it wasn't Star Wars Akalai because of how it was presented.

[00:17:05] So I really didn't enjoy it by the end and the reveal is up with it. How about you Chris? I don't know. I this for me suffered from that they haven't learned

[00:17:16] how to tee up an end of an episode. This felt written in a strange way. I don't know. We know the MCU can do that cliffhanger. Now Amazon do it best Netflix actually pioneered it. Like we've

[00:17:32] seen it with the umbrella cadmium, like the Daredevil show and the the Tlander shows up covered. They set up the episode and it's you pay off what just happened in the last episode. The tea

[00:17:45] up some good stuff and then you resolve part of it and then you leave it cliffhanger to basically want me you want to either binge into the next episode or build up enough conversation that

[00:17:57] the next week you're gagging to know what happened and you build this fervor and people come to a podcast to speculate and discuss and discuss and review what happened. This unfortunately

[00:18:13] parts of this didn't make me go feverish. Oh my god I want to go and like I'm dying to the next episode. So I did watch this in chunks of two and kind of as I kind of called open pits and I

[00:18:26] but I wasn't we didn't actually just and that's how I knew I wasn't heavily invested. No let me before I finished that sentence I enjoyed it by the end, similar to you Daredevil. By the end of

[00:18:37] this show I was like you know what that was actually good looking back as a whole it was good but we didn't actually discuss it much as a affair between ourselves. We were watching it but we weren't

[00:18:49] hey did you get this to check this or like did you know that this was oh my god and that's how I knew I wasn't it it wasn't connecting as much with me yeah and it should I love the older public.

[00:19:03] I played 90 of the public one and two back to front quite a lot. I've started some of the comics that they're running in this in the high republic stuff so all of this should connect with me

[00:19:15] basically with a jitter height of the power like the cool whips of the new jitter the jitter with lightsaber things like that where I'm like oh but unfortunately part of it just didn't really

[00:19:28] come together in a way that I think really should have melted. This felt like it was trying to do a criminal like you said that mystery noir where it's like it's trying to be almost a presicopricidual

[00:19:44] mystery but it's not that we're part of that. I don't I don't go too much into this and no John I want to hear what your opinion is but isn't that the weird part about it you think

[00:19:52] when it's setting up the show that it is this mystery noir but actually what you think are your detectives are the people that committed the crime in the first place basically yeah so that's

[00:20:01] all great twists if you're doing something like that but I don't I think the reason it isn't connecting or didn't connect and the reason why we didn't all discuss it together Chris was because

[00:20:10] there were in those moments of did you see Luke Skywalker turn up on that episode did you see Chubak here on that episode there weren't any of those moments because it's so disconnected from

[00:20:18] the Star Wars universe and the treatment of the storyline is so different from anything we've seen from the live action or animated shows before as well. John what about you? So just before I

[00:20:30] do you think it's not yes yeah before I do actually say that it's just Chris you did have a studio Griffin moment there in your monologue where you said cool whips and kind of the cool

[00:20:40] but yes so I did quite like that and so I'm kind of with you two to be honest on this. I think by the third or fourth I was like I don't know what I'm supposed to feel about this show

[00:20:55] yep yeah and then you got the and a can't remember which episode exactly it was the thing was episode five and it was like that was okay this has sort of this is brought it dragged it

[00:21:10] into carrying about this hey yeah episode five was the episode says where we where we finally got to see the the Sith Master I guess we think so that's the big moment I guess exactly and and I think

[00:21:24] that's the thing it's so divorced from the Star Wars lore that we know yet it is obviously in that world and there's plenty of other material around that I think if you're bringing it to

[00:21:37] this point you want to invest in the characters and it was really difficult to understand that. I lots of stuff I loved in here around the convergence and you know effectively yeah um uh OSHA

[00:21:52] and may you know being of one like the idea you know one of them is evil one of them is good there and yeah so I kind of really like that I think it's also just a fact that you know

[00:22:08] it depends how you get to the reveals that they do as well and I just felt rather than trying to do a big reveal in a era that isn't that well known to a lot of people

[00:22:23] go through it like you know like brilliantly in death play just but I just like just have him there like you know and the interactions and how it's all complicated or whatever but I mean anyway

[00:22:37] like in the end I got to really like enjoy this I mean who doesn't like you know sexy say as well I mean or even just that notion or sexy sense you know it's kind of it's

[00:22:50] an important dynamic that actually potentially these two um you know the two and have some kind of chemistry there but it wasn't even that it's just they felt like there would be coming friends

[00:23:06] so anyway there's a lot I really enjoyed in this but I don't know whether I really thought it sort of hit it didn't hit the ground running that I think it needed to be less sort of massive

[00:23:17] revelatory at the end and have those moments at each episode being revelatory like you say Chris and I think um well that's a talk about it because there are reasons within the writing

[00:23:30] as to why all the reals happen at the end of this series so let's talk about that a bit more and depth but the other I suppose the other aspect of it as I said set a good a mystery show

[00:23:38] where you're keeping all those reveals back in an era where we don't know anything about the characters makes it very difficult to connect with them but also another big writing choices that they made is having the un reliable narrators were following characters who were

[00:23:52] being told are good because they're Jedi are being told are bad because they're Sith and by the end of the series they've all switched positions to good and bad to differ to facts the all the

[00:24:04] good guys are bad guys all the bad guys are good guys by the end of the series they're all interesting ideas but very difficult to latch on to uh to those characters exactly like I

[00:24:12] remember we're the first things I saw about the act like after it appeared we were away and all it isn't in the episodes uh until after we got back but then the first things are so it was

[00:24:20] they put carry on muscle poster and then kill you in the opening scene that's it I'm out I'm gone from the show and she was in four more episodes but because of the narrators we're way

[00:24:30] that they'd chosen to tell the story you instantly turned off people who tuned in to watch carry on muscle so it was a really interesting experiment for uh for Star Wars but I'm just

[00:24:40] not sure whether connected with the people that they wanted to actually watch exactly and I think even having the two flashback episodes well we definitely talk about that in our first Saber point as we usually do we pick our Saber points which will be things that should cover

[00:24:54] this time the entire series of the shows so let's start off with Saber point number one so really the show as as we said already in kind of the intro there the show is set around

[00:25:13] a central mystery which you're trying to discover and let's just talk about that as as I suppose as our big point what's the re big reveal in the show the big reveal is actually

[00:25:21] talked about right at the end of the series when ocean may are splitting up for the final time they say they're rhymed to each other the you are with me I am with you always one born as two

[00:25:31] that in itself is a master of real it's it's revealed that may an OSHA were created from the force by their mother they aren't twins at all they're actually one being created from the force

[00:25:41] split into two so not twins not sisters they're at the same being split into two which is an interesting reveal to start and sol was concerned about that about the amount of parabying the hands

[00:25:53] of someone that's outside of the controls of the Jedi accidentally killed their mom and thought that may was dead so because the mom and may were dead the people that were involved in the creation

[00:26:03] of the of May and OSHA only OSHA left they decided to hide this fact from the rest of the galaxy there's nothing to prove that this creation happened and so it's hidden and he did this

[00:26:14] at the request of master Indara who's carry on mosses character and her parabying had gone a bit crazy from them being on the planet between her and she rushed in to her been yet rushed in

[00:26:25] and almost got himself killed and then as a reaction to all of this that's what sets off may on her killings pre-effectively going after killing them all because sol has covered this

[00:26:38] up and Daris covered this up torb and and the wookie Jedi they've all covered this up so that's kind of the big reveal at the end of that because of that denial so may trains with the Daris

[00:26:50] side trains with the community and gets her revenge and all of these Jedi so that's the that's the big reveal at the end of the central mystery the big reveal at the end of the story

[00:26:57] what did you think of the that being the big reveal and revealed in basically episode seven and eight of the show that this is everything that actually happened like I did like this reveal I mean

[00:27:07] firstly I love that they had witches here I mean I think on brandok you know again I think coming from a soaker I think having the witches of death appear it's really interesting and seeing this

[00:27:22] again again very powerful which is and very powerful abilities to control the force with you know this convergence that they were investigating here and and the soldiers it's almost a tapping into the force we've heard about the forces as a as a something that penetrates and binds

[00:27:42] this is the way it was always talked about before here they're talking about pulling on the threads of the force to use this and gain its power that's why I really like this kind of

[00:27:50] an idea for me right up there with you know force wielding witches the death of these I mean again it plays into sort of a coverage of the bad batch from the last season as well where you

[00:28:07] know you saw the empire taking young force sensitive people and different species from their mothers and here you have the same thing happening again with the Jedi again that kind of similarity

[00:28:23] with the Sith but also it being looked on as more players but in this instance it's not because you have this cover of witches effectively white out for seemingly being and you know bad evil dangerous even though you know the Jedi for all their supposed calmness and meditation

[00:28:48] aren't able to talk to them yeah I like the internal conflict around that within the group itself I mean I do think Torbin was a little bit wingsie which I really surprised that

[00:29:02] from the actor who you know's been in game of Thrones and in was 1916 the movie the and normally a great actor yeah I just felt as character was really sort of whiny and actually

[00:29:20] it's because like you just wanted to get back to chorus and that effectively everything goes belly up and the whole situic I just that some of the motivations didn't feel right and well

[00:29:35] I wish they had kind of started off so we learnt more about the witches and you know because even with the little amount of time you got the sense of actually a loving mother witch

[00:29:49] I'm 100% and 100% this all comes from soul thinking that the witches having this access to the powers of threat to the Jedi power they're not under the control of the Jedi Jedi are supposed to be

[00:30:01] the guardians of the galaxy that's safer one to another at series here and but but that's that's where all stems from the his side Torbin getting frustrated as I went into the

[00:30:12] Jedi order to learn how to be a Jedi and here I am taking scientific samples from a planet for five and a half months can we just go home yeah I kind of got at least you know that's that's a little bit

[00:30:21] Anakin Skywalker the whiny paddawans so I kind of get that from him but I just really quickly I know we're gonna go over to you Chris about this but I just really quickly say there's the scene where

[00:30:30] we see older Torbin 13 16 years later 15 years later where he's been meditating for years and growing the beard and I was like that beard looks weird a beard looks so weird I mean haven't seen them

[00:30:41] as the young paddawans until that time and then I realized oh this is baby faced dude Charles Chapman who we saw in Game of Thrones throwing himself into window he did not grow

[00:30:51] that beard somebody stuck some cut some cut wall in his face he does not look any older than 22 or 23 so I just that took the age of his scene in the older the older age I age it better but I

[00:31:04] sorry for interrupting you're not sorry you had more say about such a mystery no so it was just like I enjoyed the central mystery but narratively some of the sort of reasons for

[00:31:17] the actions that happened not of it really connected with me and so I kind of just lost it like I think having a focus on OSHA and May with that coffin for part of this you know and even

[00:31:35] if it was flitting between their and cursant to build the story and that's the thing I felt like it was in the end the central mystery was to say you know maybe the Jedi answers good as we all think

[00:31:52] the art fine but also then just to almost have the Yoda moment and you know the Darth Plages moment so it kind of got lost but I mean luckily episode five rescues it for me

[00:32:11] yeah and the motivations were good all of this at the reveal of May being alive not having dyes yeah and but I was at the end of the first episode as well I'll tell you the one thing that

[00:32:24] broke it from me I really annoyed me in the series about how the story was told effectively in episode two we guess Saul telling May the story of what happened when he was able to take her from

[00:32:37] her family and it's all a lie that's what we find at the end of the series it's all a cover up he's been covering it up not telling May the story but that did the flashback episode where we see

[00:32:47] May and OSHA with her with their family the the witches on brandok and that is the story that Saul has just told in the previous episode and was an entire episode of another lie telling us just showing

[00:33:00] us on screen what Saul had told us so it felt like a waste of an episode and that absolutely should have been a real central episode of the series you get to know these kids and what their lies

[00:33:09] were like before the Jedi come in took one of them away it would have been a much more interesting series had you put a bit of the daze in our minds set that seed in our mind in episode three

[00:33:20] that maybe Saul's not telling the truth but it was just the tale he told in the previous episode and after way to get way another week for a bit more of the story that by that stage you were going

[00:33:28] well this seems a bit odd and amazed at their killing Jedi episode one she kills one up so two she kills another episode three episode four she'll kill the fourth and then what I

[00:33:39] working out after the series so yeah more Jedi deaths than older six to six it was proper bloodbath of the Jedi before before the other Star Wars fans got on we know there was about

[00:33:51] 50,000 Jedi died during the series but there was a lot of unscreened and I mean I have say I did I like that sort of unflinching sort of they're not immortal yeah yeah yeah yeah that was really

[00:34:04] good absolutely why about your secrets what about your thoughts on the central mystery and the reveal for me for me theoretically this should have been something I absolutely loved yeah thematically the storyline here is the Jedi are we the bad guys yeah basically it was like the Jedi

[00:34:20] it's trying to flip it the witches should have been the good guys because open till unless you basically play Jedi so far any of the Jedi games usually the witches are kind of more leaning towards the bad like in Asoka they're aligned with the empire and a lot

[00:34:40] of the other shows typically they are more lines towards the bad guys so here essentially we are the witches being the good guys and the Jedi it is revealed to be the bad typically we would also

[00:34:58] see then maybe there's a singular Jedi character who learns this big reveal and go no and then brings it to the cancel and tries to resolve it it didn't earn any of this what we've seen is

[00:35:11] the Jedi still being the bad guys the witches are killed off and then on the unsurprisingly the ending of the central mystery as it resolved is you know we're just gonna wipe the memory

[00:35:27] and it's gonna continue on and for me when you're trying to build this central week to week mystery they didn't drip feet enough yes so that was my problem I I as a whole it was kind of cool

[00:35:45] like the singular one being spit into two but I kind of guess parts of that already I was kind of actually guessing that it was like more the one force good one force bad

[00:35:57] but actually it was that one force spit into two and both can be good or bad depending on the thing so they're not really I can't cool yeah it's a little bit more nature versus

[00:36:09] nurture like that yeah yeah again we I mentioned that word in Star Wars University they're called a die add something that is foreign and one's good ones bad when the two come together they

[00:36:18] form a whole kind of thing that's that's the die add this isn't a die add the both them are born both them are created from one they are exactly the same and it's turned to the dark side

[00:36:28] and one maybe might be turned to the light but yeah as well you started the series thinking one's in the light and yeah yeah they've turned because of the the events or all you know

[00:36:41] or just the possession of things yeah I mean you know it I like that nature nurture thing it's not like oh you know I look evil therefore I'm going to be a Sith you know there are these

[00:36:56] external factors like ultimately with the creation of Anakin you know and Darth Vader so like it's really consistent it's really good really enjoying it but it just as I say because it's

[00:37:10] aimed at this reveal like you say it just feels like wasted episode I mean even for me seeing the stranger come here he was one of the best bits of of this because really mysterious you

[00:37:24] know that the the the the and sort of the shadowy figure that the the hand you know moving the chest pieces in terms of may here at this notion of almost like a proto Sith you know again

[00:37:43] loads of different things to his and possible origins that this huge M-scar on his back and certainly linked with Vanessa as being you know Vanessa just powder one that's right but

[00:37:56] nothing really concrete comes from it and you can see him kind of being like the best bits of his on his and the the planet where he's with Oshah he realizes he's not got me and

[00:38:15] just almost the manipulation with which tries to bring her round but I just felt like there was so much more that you needed to understand about this yeah this person the stranger and Darth

[00:38:30] pages was there so that means you know there's now suddenly three there's more than two I wouldn't normally the Sith are in pairs and then they will kill their master in order to then become the master

[00:38:42] and take on an apprentice so is this you know what's going on it is effectively this piece of or is this a two some with and come here and Oshah and he doesn't know that

[00:39:02] or is he just discovering it there at the end of the episode like it's really hard to keep talking about Darth Thlegas because he is literally in there for three seconds I missed him on first watch

[00:39:10] because he's in the darkness since shadows and I was watching him on my phone it was only when I saw the internet going oh wow he's there at the background that's Darth Thlegas yeah

[00:39:18] and just for those of you that don't know and a lot of us don't know from Darth Thlegas or you have to find out of the internet yeah well who this yellow I got I was like oh he's a Sith

[00:39:30] what does this mean because I they don't it's just a guy in the background exactly and he's always been a guy in the background he's never been seen before in live action he has had a novel I think

[00:39:40] in the extended universal signal language this but he has had a novel and he was mentioned in one light of dialogue by palpatine by emperor palpatine when trying to turn an Anakin that he's the

[00:39:50] one that discovered how to create life from death that is he'd the only real line in all the series and the other thing we know about him is that palpatine was his padawan and he killed him so

[00:40:02] so what it does throw up but it stopped me here if I'm going way too crazy of the theories of what might happen the future but what if those rope is is came here a really young version of

[00:40:12] emperor palpatine and he actually you know somehow palpatine returned the whole thing in the end maybe palpatine is here right in front of us looking like a mirror and then he turns himself into looking

[00:40:21] a bit more like at the sanitary of of of at naboo in the future yeah never know just tell me hides himself I and hundreds years time you never know and I mean so maybe that's not explained how he could

[00:40:34] possibly have had a child as everybody was saying it better emperor palpatine we find out that he's had children you go ahead of the ever have sex I will be looked like a mirror when he was younger

[00:40:42] yeah well it's actually yeah like I mean as I say I think just for me I wanted the immersiveness in their stories and the old republic I don't I what yes central mystery is good but in a sense

[00:41:00] it played too much of a first brittle to actually understanding some of the motivations and so on of these characters because most of them a dies and secondly yeah and you know who's to say that

[00:41:15] given a pleasure is kind of looking fully creepily from the shadows that kaneer is not going to die very quickly in a second season if they get one so there's a whole sense of stuff being lost here

[00:41:30] and I felt you know it's a messels in the old republic with you know a good story which I think the central mystery is but structurally to me it just doesn't work yeah yeah I look for me

[00:41:50] I'm just gonna because I know we do really go into other saber points I coming into the show I expected and or in the old republic I was expecting a more mature piece about the

[00:42:07] act like because they said this was about the dark side act like that and I was like oh cool you're gonna give us like a greaty dark side kind of student master piece almost like lumbulf

[00:42:22] kind of and like I'm more to say a Japanese style like lumbulf and coke but more but a dark pad one or pad one being turned to darkness back like become a not going I was like this is

[00:42:33] going to be greaty unreal and I feel unfortunately they missed that step they they they had the options there to really go into some of the dark side of the star was in

[00:42:47] could have gone more into tell us about the witches show how the Jedi were not always the good guys back when they became and did some of the dark things that they did which we know about

[00:43:01] they did like they did take young four cents of children to train them as a padlin we know the Jedi weren't always they were good guys but sometimes they were

[00:43:10] corrupt police man or hit things yeah I think you could have gone more into that and I feel they started to trickle and then just pull back a bit too much in thematically I think that's where

[00:43:23] we missed these beat to beats and they rehash things we were like yeah no we got that on the first and you didn't need to show us again exactly exactly you didn't need to have your major character

[00:43:32] telling a story and which was a lie and then showing that story on screen in third episode as a said that that was my real day and full and I wasn't sure after episode three whether it would

[00:43:41] come back for me it did an episode five but episode five and episode six are where we lose lots of names Jedi yeah you know it's a great way to set up a community the stranger it's great

[00:43:53] to set him up as how being massively powerful as he hunts the molden and the forest bush you know you have you have an actress like Daffy Keen who was in Logan and was in the Golden

[00:44:04] Compass series you know a very well-known actress who's been talking about her role in the show ages and then she's just slaughtered you know she has a big moment in that episode absolutely

[00:44:13] but had these been characters that you'd watch the season of in the old Republic of Star Wars getting to know them all and then this happens and brings out a Sith where he kills all these

[00:44:23] characters that you're really attached to you know that'll be a big thing but I felt like they hadn't done enough of the attachment part of that and that's why me in the process sometimes

[00:44:33] I just feel that the way a lot of shows go is like we have to keep everything hidden yeah and the big reveal is something really actually in the end not that big yeah and I wonder

[00:44:48] and I wonder whether they're trying to avoid some of the more controversial sides of things and the big the easiest the easiest allegory here is that the Jedi Order had become organized religion at the time and groups like the witches are the first people's

[00:45:02] or the first nations that were overrun by this massive organization that goes if you don't believe in our religion then you're wrong and you have to die effectively so that's where they could have

[00:45:12] gone and never really got there. It's there but maybe if they lean into that a bit more would have made it a bit more punchier or make them to more interesting I guess for the early part of

[00:45:24] the season. So just wouldn't very quick one and again this has not been explained it is you they never even touch on it but it's right in front of your eyes the wookie master he is taken over

[00:45:35] by the witches we find that out in the reveal right and then is free. Skip for it when he is died and he is living alone on this planet he is drawing the same markings that is from the witches

[00:45:50] he draws and does all their symbols he is left the Jedi Order he's gone into exile they never even talk about it he exiled himself and then started to focus on the witches religion yeah and it's a

[00:46:04] really interesting kind of point it is yeah he then he gets killed by the stranger never gets talked to it never you think he doesn't we don't even get to hear from him like and they focus on

[00:46:16] him drawing the symbol on maze head like that is what he's done but again like that's never even and I feel that's why I feel sometimes I feel they might have dropped some things yeah

[00:46:30] I feel they might have edited out and it may be suffering from that because if they were to talk about that and show like the wookie being like living and kind of I don't know telling

[00:46:45] us why he left and why he feels so bad why he's gone into that over a season and then kill him off yeah that's where you were in that pain exactly and I feel they skipped show end and then told

[00:46:58] but it's a coincidence yeah it's something that nobody else is going to investigate that character again we're never going to see someone asked the question about why was Kenaka so taken with that religion

[00:47:07] why did he turn away from the Jedi Order this was the season to show that this was the season to discuss that it was very cool that to have uh you know so so the time we'll back uh playing

[00:47:16] Kalnaka who played Chewbacca in the laser movies after Peter May who passed away it's kind of cool to have him back in in the wookiee. Absolutely I'm quite like a light saver here yeah yeah yeah and

[00:47:28] I think the other thing to say is you know a mandala stember who plays May and OSHA yeah like she really does get the distinction between the two it's really good you know I'm doing that

[00:47:41] for the whole and season yeah I think when they're doing the cop game a couple of times as an audience member whether you know whether putting May and one outfit that she looks like OSHA even

[00:47:51] then you can tell the difference between the two. Yeah I thought it was really good. I thought that was great yeah could we talk about her as we go on to the second point or by where she

[00:48:02] ends up because I think distinctively what they've done to that character and the ending like as an actress was fantastic yeah absolutely yes well the saver point two is all about the ending let's move on there.

[00:48:26] See yes the final choices as we as we get the reveal of the central mystery which has been going round a quite a lot throughout the season and we talked about a lot the final choices

[00:48:35] that were made at the end of the season. The big moment I guess is when OSHA finally hears the truth revealed from from Saul that she goes Sith she goes bad and kills Saul

[00:48:48] and then bleeds into a cyber crystal turning it to red. That's massive and again something that we've have we've seen before but myself a Chris definitely as gamers have seen that in the the Jedi video

[00:49:01] games as blood drives the cyber crystal to turn it to red. It's very cool in video game, very cool to see this for the first time and live action and seeing it from a character that you've

[00:49:12] followed along in the story as being your good guy, your sensual hero with the show whether you know as you learn that Saul is actually not the hero you think he is and you're still on the

[00:49:23] side of OSHA that she's the hero of the show and seeing her bleed into the kind of crystal to turn it red. There's lots of great moments there with that I think. Yeah and it's an awesome moment.

[00:49:33] It's really really good. Yeah it's cool. I love this and again we're talking about the arc that you that was in the Skywalker saga of Anakin Skywalker becoming Sith and becoming Darth Vader you know

[00:49:44] a lot of people myself included not sure whether that stuck the landing of why he would go so bad in revenge of the Sith here without sure you're gone I actually understand here why she is so

[00:49:57] angry at Saul the person that she trusted most from the Jedi order. Why she's so angry at him and and feeds it to the Dark Side of the Ghost. And he even kicked her from the order like she left but

[00:50:08] he reveals in the final episode then he pushed her to go because she would have been too old even become a Jedi because she was they knew even taking her in that she was too old to come upon

[00:50:21] right. So to be taken as a young um and I look the bleed for me to turn her to the Sith. Turning her to the Dark Side I feel was fantastic like what felt less earned was making me

[00:50:40] flipping her back to being essentially OSHA because they just wipe her memory on everything and now she in if we get season 2 which I think might be likely. I think it's on. Yeah. OSHA's now the maze never good OSHA's never bad they basically flipped.

[00:51:02] To be creepy because they just basically made made the blank slates to who doesn't know she has a doesn't have many memories she doesn't know really what happened she has some memories of the death

[00:51:18] and things like that didn't know she had a sister anymore. Well for an extra reveal that to her so I think it's more of a fact. OSHA's made her choice she's going off to train with

[00:51:26] the community or she's going off to train in the ways of the Sith. The alternate version let's say in the Jedi I'm not too sure where the Sith is even but said in the show but

[00:51:34] may as wiped and left with the Jedi at the end at this end point of the show but I'm not too sure it says definitive as it's seem to be at the start of the season that may is on the good side

[00:51:46] and OSHA's on the bad because we know all the other stuff about what's going on with the Jedi. It's a great way to finish off the season and I hope there's more of that story to come

[00:51:57] in the future hope or hope we are going to get to see us a second season. I think it's reasonably likely a Sunday with Kamakhan's coming up just as we're about to finish off the show and then

[00:52:07] start with celebration coming up in a couple of weeks time so they are much slower it doesn't need to announce shows as they then they were in the past so that's very likely if they were

[00:52:15] as an announcement you hold that off for Sunday or Kamakhan or for celebration if it's only a couple of weeks away from the end of the series right? I did think they were going to melt

[00:52:25] I thought because it was the convergence and their whole thing is from two to one one to two. I did think there was going to be this when they were hugging something was going to happen

[00:52:37] under the tree where I was like oh with a force coming like make them want to be back together I think they are the epitome of the great Jedi good and bad and both of them can be

[00:52:50] good and bad at the same time something like that maybe that's a future maybe like they'll split them in her lightaber we blew one red and half kind of thing.

[00:53:02] Even I think just the fact that you know may got the symbol on her foreheads because she went through the ceremony and it's like it didn't really matter there was nothing that really seemed to come

[00:53:14] of that and what it was just heard declaring her commitment to her mama. It's just a way to the importance then I've seen the wookie Jedi drawing these as well you know that they have

[00:53:25] do have meanings that is some powerful significance here because the Jedi were trying to prevent the other one from going through this ceremony because the death of me which is can do stuff Jedi can't like we know that from the games like this teleportation there's like force tunnels

[00:53:43] there's definitely things that they do that fear actually maybe a Jedi could if they trained but like they just do the witches do stuff Jedi don't. Yeah so I was expecting part of that but

[00:53:54] that never really kind of manifested it's just sad because we're seeing a lot of them back to the Jedi it's just sad they're very carefully for what they've done but but the reason they stopped those are going through is because if I should go through that she's

[00:54:06] committed to self to another order they can't take her away like all Jedi do you know. Well then she did want to become a Jedi. She wanted to be a Jedi. Yeah I mean but I like the fact that

[00:54:14] she goes with to train with a community here like I think community at the stranger I do like the fact that he was known as Smiler Ren as well because of the helmet and the smile

[00:54:26] the character you love to do. I thought it was cool because I think he is the coolest character of this for me anyway in the show along with soul I really like souls character and I do like

[00:54:41] me an oh shit as well but I think community just shows that real it's almost feels like an organic way of becoming the Sith obviously something happened which shouldn't find out about but it's the fact that he didn't just kill Oshah when she when he realized that

[00:55:05] had been switched you know you got the sense or I mean you two kept the sense of him trying to mentor her really and that you know it was just this is the alternative way you know so again to that

[00:55:18] whole religious point these are the kind of my guess if you want to come out of it from this angle these are the the Protestants effectively never testing against the next one ever all

[00:55:33] I'm the Lutherans or the Lutherans yeah I actually I take it bigger than that it's probably Christianity or a little bit more like a little bit more like a little bit more like a little bit

[00:55:41] because career comes across as just he's free you know there's the Jedi is a base rules and regulations and control and setting up their their form of society can be reduced in a classic

[00:55:57] classic way um just like Jackie Chan and Duncan Master basically you know you don't suspect who this character is the guy who's drunk a sleep when may comes in and wakes him up he's just

[00:56:08] the sidekick to her and then you see the big reveal that actually he is the Jedi Master effect of the Sith Master so he's introduced in this chilled-at-way he's got his own place he's has a

[00:56:19] great answer for everything that every question that that OSHA has for him he's living off the land he's totally happy with himself and he's been inside the Jedi order as we find out by the end of

[00:56:30] the series so he's not just trying to darkly manipulate somebody in front of me saying look at the life I chose to have after the Jedi um with may having her mind wiped at the end of the series that

[00:56:43] is her saying to OSHA that the question that she posed OSHA I'm not going to tell you what to do you do what you want to do what is it that you want what's the thing you want to do and what

[00:56:52] you want to do is keep her safe and go off an explorer this side the other side the non-jet-eye side so if that that way that she gives the choice to may and is willingly willingly accepts having

[00:57:04] her mind wiped I thought it was a really good arc for her story as well yeah and the the look the stranger is cool his helmet school his outfit school his slight air was cool do you think they did they kind of

[00:57:20] cuts into two when the smaller version like a dagger yes and all the classics sort of Japanese Katana and the dagger you know yeah exactly um and look that looks fantastic and the actor who plays

[00:57:34] him fantastic yeah from the good place like yeah he's the he's the absolute proper bimbo or himbo from from the good place for the first couple of seasons or easily a major character is there but

[00:57:46] just did not expect that was him and that's how he's really good like they revealed for me was so I want to know more and this is like by the end of this season I want to know more about

[00:57:56] the acolyte and the master like what happens in season two between these two as they journey it down the dark and path I'm genuinely interested in seeing because he is as you guys have said

[00:58:09] he has a mystery background he why is he the way he doesn't he kind of tries to draw her in but then also where is helmet is a shield it is a sensory deprivation so he's just him in the force

[00:58:23] but also stopped people sensing him as well and it's so interesting because when OSHA puts that on like we get that she her power expands and she's able to see the future to a degree as well

[00:58:37] and I'm like oh that it's so interesting place oh and then the big thing that everyone has talked about is this is these helmets are obviously quite similar to Kyla Rends and the knights of REN

[00:58:50] so apparently part of this as well it falls in down gears later is found by the likes of the REN and how they do things which is really interesting but overall love the stranger as a character

[00:59:07] he's so cool yeah so definitely really enjoyed him so I'm one of the other major characters in the show master of Renestra one of the only surviving Jedi actually that we're used to now that I think about it

[00:59:17] and a really interesting character because she's kept so far away from the central story she's the one that's back at the Jedi cancel the guests back on back in chorus and she's kept away from

[00:59:27] everything that's going on um she's the one that chooses to create this lie when she finds what's actually happened she's the one that choose to cover it all up um really to avoid investigation

[00:59:41] into the Jedi order so maybe there's more of that to come as to why she made that decision uh here um but it seems like hang on a second I have an opportunity here to tie this all up

[00:59:51] and meet the little package presented to the world like these were just uh this was just one bad Jedi in our order and close it all off here and it's one character that I felt needed a bit more

[01:00:02] development and one thing that is that I would definitely not have gotten from watching the show at all the reason they keep mentioning that she gets space sick is in the the book that she originally

[01:00:16] appeared in when she traveled through um intergalactic space she has visions of the past and the feature did you guys get that at all so so when she arrives on the planet where Sol has just been

[01:00:29] killed she arrives on the planet she gets an echo of force echo effectively of everything of the entire tale laid out in front of her so that's why she knows everything that's happening but

[01:00:39] that's why they keep mentioning this space sickness that she gets oh did you actually go in a spaceship oh how are you feeling is there you still got a headache they mentioned it so many times

[01:00:48] but I wouldn't have gotten it from the show at all that this is a this part of her force Paris effectively as that she can see the future and the and the past if she travels through

[01:00:57] hyperspace effectively so um so there's all of that there is why did she make this choice to hide the Jedi from uh scrutiny effectively so and um I the presence of career as well yeah who's

[01:01:11] watches her and he's got the the reason why he's got the deprivation helmet on is one of the reasons for that is to block her from having her visions and seeing him so the reason so when he's not where

[01:01:22] in the helmet she can sense that he's there so he's sent a few senses him the minute she gets on the planet so uh a little the lack of a veteran and I'll be one can know with her as well yeah it's definitely

[01:01:32] it's I'm interested to see where that goes because they do set up that mystery i'm they start setting up the status versus the Jedi exactly which we've seen play out different plays before but again political paris is religious power yeah we're saying government versus police exactly

[01:01:52] and a hundred years time as we've seen in the pre-cooled trilogy really this the Jedi and Senate were quite closely together until the answer is really there's a fracture coming and then

[01:02:00] the fracture is fixed as well yeah exactly so it's like how all of these things start to pull together I'm maybe interested yeah and let's talk about she goes to one of her masters yoda

[01:02:16] yeah that should have been understood you're right thing be like they should have got like at least rather than just we all know who gild it is we all know what he looks like so just showing the back

[01:02:29] I think they should have walked in on the council and you showed the council and kind of like we have an issue there is a disturbance in the balance they need to set up a bit more there

[01:02:40] and maybe they have just haven't wrote it yet maybe that could be the issue and they don't know where they're going but for me that's they've settled this character like oh she's connected to him

[01:02:50] she's blocking this why not she's where that's going because at the moment it's resolved that's the problem yeah but I think there's a very good reason why you do that because you don't

[01:03:04] want to have a show that steps are over at the legacy of yoda you don't have a show where yoda's complicit in hiding this information about the guy so you want this character you don't really

[01:03:14] know about well master for nastro you want her to be the one that covers up the whole idea that Sith could be back in the universe and back in the galaxy you want to cover all that up

[01:03:23] so nobody knows about it at the end of the series that's all wiped clean and now she's going to yoda I think that actual conversation if you'd had another couple of lines all it would be is

[01:03:33] the senators start to respect the something wrong with the jada or want to investigate it how do I deal with this master yoda I think that's the actual conversation but if you bring yoda

[01:03:40] in earlier on and he's complicit and what she's doing here you've got a big change to your yoda character right yeah that's true yeah that that literally could be why they did it but

[01:03:54] for me the conclusions of this and the way they set up all the characters I'm interested to see and that that's the big part from the big nailing solution is they've done the right thing

[01:04:09] in terms of the the the scene setting for the end exactly exactly and that one thing I do want to move us on to save a point number three yes let's move on to our third and final save point

[01:04:20] for this episode yes the final set of the characters the characters the setting overall and you know the battles we talked a bit about about some of them there but as we went

[01:04:38] through here we talked about some of the some of the major actors and some really classic performance and really good performances in here John you mentioned earlier on about about cell master soul carrying the series really Lee Jong Jai yeah carrying the series um he was such

[01:04:55] a good actor in squid game where he is from career originally that's it was all delivered in Korean and apparently got the role because it was of his time in squid game and learned English for

[01:05:07] the show um he's not an native English speaker where that's and he learned as as filming started he had only learned his lines in English for the for the first episode and for the

[01:05:17] first part of the first part of filming let's say and by the end of the series he was he was he was able to deliver all of his lines but that's how good he was in squid game he could get across

[01:05:25] the emotion of that character going through everything that he was going through and now he's playing a Jedi a conflicted Jedi throughout the series and holding the show that's the fascinating to me

[01:05:34] I'm able to do that yeah no I mean I thought he was excellent and I think the three main principal characters you know Lee Jong Jai a mandala stemberg and and Manage Jacinto I thought

[01:05:49] these three actors were absolutely super man and that's why I also want to see a season two in the really good and you know I as I say I think with Dean Charles Chapman as Torbin I think

[01:06:06] just the character yeah it wasn't anything wrong with the performance but it just fell strange and again it was just like there you go you know and and I guess as well it's maybe just

[01:06:23] sometimes the format you know if you'd had a two and a half hour three hour movie this may have been a really different proposition I totally agree that I was even thinking about this today with

[01:06:35] with them being released episodically I love weekly shows you guys know that it met so that all the time with it being weekly shows people were dropping off after a few episodes because it wasn't

[01:06:43] still a ringing universe they felt they were connected to that's the that's what I certainly got from from some of the criticism by Star Wars fans not the ones that you know rated it one but I

[01:06:54] watching an episode the ones that stuck with a few episodes you know but if you were going to the cinema to watch a Star Wars movie you absolutely would watch all two and a half hours that

[01:07:02] movie and then make up your mind at the end of it when you walk out of the cinema what you thought of it you wouldn't walk out after 15 minutes and go not for me nobody does that with Star Wars

[01:07:11] movies right so so it's a different idea that's why I think the format of the show would have worked really well if you were doing telling a Star Wars story a mystery like this where people

[01:07:22] have to say it's in watch to the end but nobody is of the obligation to sit in a watch and an episode series if they choose that that's not for them because not revealing it doesn't

[01:07:30] feel like the universe but the actors were doing such a great job I thought Caria Moss was really good in her background role yeah when you thought she was going to be what she thought she was

[01:07:40] going to be major character put in her background role she delivered her guidance so well and felt like part of the universe really really good yeah and that wrote as well but yeah some good stuff

[01:07:49] anybody else is still there to anybody anything else you'd say to the bandals I think like you said I mean I think certainly uh career versus the the Jedi in the forest absolutely

[01:08:01] Jedi's falling like flies hey there and I was like everybody got a moment out of it as well yeah and I really enjoyed it because um you know that's the thing in a sense that's what I liked about

[01:08:14] this character so ruthless in battle yeah seemingly and maybe that's just being drawn in by the Sith and maybe that's the point and maybe that would be something that you get from a season two

[01:08:28] but then just you know you would say silver tongs in a sense but you get from this because you have that preconception around Sith or proto Sith or whatever we're seeing it play out with the Jedi that they are equally a silver tongs just and I really like

[01:08:52] that moment and on the sisters fight I found it weird that Caria Moss has character somehow killed literally the entire coffin from some trance that they were doing and I really didn't understand that so is it like unplugging the internet it felt like yeah exactly what it was

[01:09:12] it was unplugging them from the matrix whether still connecting no member like yeah pulling them out whether it was exactly that like they were just making some trance I I feel like they were all pulling pushing their power through the central

[01:09:26] sister when she died they all died that's that's what I feel happens actually a soul on soul's head that they died no but I thought it was coming from Caria Moss I thought she

[01:09:33] kind of liked something with her they flipped her hair and then next thing that all dead I think the main thing was saw is that he kills Oshia's mother yeah yeah yeah the main thing yeah and there

[01:09:46] are I'm sorry they're all in a trance together you're right and I just felt that was weird yeah I didn't kind of understand why what was happening actually genocide that sounds really bad but

[01:10:00] that's effectively that's why I mean actually so I really enjoyed the galaxy of the higher a public you know that's setting really good I'm just wondering is it you know and it's playing with preconceived notions exactly what you think around the Sith and the Jedi but

[01:10:22] you want that also to be mentioned and you don't really get a sense on it and even if it was so yes Yoda you don't want him to be complicit but even if you had him in the council going

[01:10:37] you know I sense that we are sort of straining from the path of what the Jedi is is we've become two corrupts to ourselves by power and that can only lead to the dark so yeah or whatever absolutely

[01:10:49] but that's what he does in quantum MS100 years later that's effectively where he is he's realizing that the Jedi may have strayed far from the path like that's that is the realization he

[01:10:58] comes to you you're absolutely right and but I do think you're right one of the things that is very different about the story as you're starting eggs with for Jedi going off doing scientific

[01:11:08] experimental planus they discover this this group of people that are there and by the end of the series what you realize is they've exterminated them all taken one of their children left them all

[01:11:19] for dead covered it all up which justifies the murders of the four Jedi you realize they are the bad guys each one of them played their parash and that's the other bit that I think is important to

[01:11:31] talk about because it felt almost like I don't know I felt like a slasher movie I felt like a Freddy Krueger or I felt like Jason you know we have each one of the Jedi masters being murdered

[01:11:42] for their parash in this ploss that ended off with the death of May's mother and then finally OSHA finding out about that plot and kill in the last member of the group so it felt like that was

[01:11:54] taking inspiration let's say from Slasher movies which I loved I hope that idea I think that's really good and you and by the end of it I didn't feel bad for the fact that those Jedi's were

[01:12:04] being killed for their parash and what they did and which is when you go in with the proof of preconceived notion that all Jedi are the good guys in the galaxy and all the other species

[01:12:15] the Sith the witches are all bad guys in the galaxy that's a good turn to accomplish by the series so and so I thought that was good cool and then the last one I just want to mention

[01:12:25] about the battles in the show just because we only finished doing the boys and we had a scene where we had we had an e-genyre fighting herself in the final episode we also have the sisters fighting

[01:12:36] guess to show their so I know they're seen where we have one actress fighting herself as well yeah the battles were really on point. They really really yeah my my last my last two

[01:12:49] cents on this is the the high republic the older public I want to see more of that light johns at I want to see more like there is the guardian Jedi the council of Jedi the the different

[01:13:01] orders of the order of the Jedi like they do different roles and to like there they there's the knights who are the more like the military arm like that is the interesting part of when they were

[01:13:12] at their highest the high republic they all do these different things so a scientific study makes sense when they are these particular order within it so seeing and they all had different high-tapers colors and different so seeing that in and by the way there were also very cool

[01:13:30] droids back then and different style of ships which we saw so all of these things is why I'm blocking to that era just seeing more of that because that stuff that's either only been

[01:13:42] waiting a bit in the books and you're like so you're imagining a lot of it yourself where you've seen some of it in comic books or the video games so seeing these how these come out

[01:13:53] in future seasons will be super interesting I think that's a really good point Chris it's kind of let's let's just go into final thoughts on the act like that's as a season just just a kind of

[01:14:02] raple part our overall thought and one of the things that just leads into lead into my final thoughts I'd love if they were able to have established the old republic with this first show set in

[01:14:14] the older public because in fairness not very many Star Wars fans have actually read any of the older public books a very small portion of them have played the video games especially as we talked

[01:14:24] about at the beginning the older public games are over 20 years old now as well and hard to get so very few people know much about the older public so if you're going to establish the world in

[01:14:34] the older public I think the act was not the show to do that I think if you did the act a lot of set it in the modern era in amongst the in amongst all the stuff we know about it

[01:14:45] in the familiar part of Star Wars it actually probably would have worked better for most people because people wouldn't expect as much out of it or would have expected that it would tie in a

[01:14:53] little bit more with the universe that we know whereas setting it so far back and it being the first time that most viewers will have seen the older public you're expecting more from it you're expecting

[01:15:02] to have exactly as you said Chris what's the setup of the Jedi order right now you can see that at all what's what's the setup of the universe what's kurosan to actually like you want to know

[01:15:11] all that stuff and I think if it's Star Wars a day building that universe with a different show and then set act like there probably would have worked a lot better for me but there's being the

[01:15:20] first show I'm worried that people haven't got the taste of that universe and aren't going to be coming back for all the incillary interesting stories that can be told in that galaxy yeah

[01:15:30] and wasn't as exciting a start to that universe as and you hope was or Star Wars episode for us yeah John overall what do you think of the act like season one yeah I mean you know

[01:15:40] I would give this uh three and a half sold tree sexy Sith out of um five and by god I would want five of those uh sold tree sexy Sith and and shirtless as well yeah absolutely and

[01:15:57] and I mean you know there's a lot I liked about this there's also a lot that I just I don't understand the choices I almost feel this would have been better off to have been in as a

[01:16:11] cinematic movie to really get that epic and and the scope of it I thought there was some really good stuff in here that I really enjoyed the the witches the three central characters absolutely fantastic

[01:16:25] the central premise of it really I think the issues came around and just the ordering of some of the episodes the two flashbacks and some of the choices made around the rationale for their actions in particular torbent and but he's like Anakin he's annoying an a team

[01:16:47] no I know but you've not got enough time with him yeah you know like let's lie with that I can put anyway I know it should be taking part you know and sand it had some it really you

[01:16:57] know it played with the all preconceptions around the good and evil of Jedi and Sith it played with those preconceived notions but I don't know there's just something as a say the first for episodes I was really just kind of going I just don't know what's

[01:17:13] that is to care about here and even on the final episode I had to watch the ending of it twice because I was like so what's happened here exactly yeah like what yeah

[01:17:27] this feels like something great when it's written down on your sketch on your writing pad to write towards if you're a writer but it feels like if you'd see that a bit more throughout the

[01:17:36] series so we understand it when it gets to the final episode it helps us all the way to the point the upending of different preconceived notions that the you know the the sheer points or

[01:17:50] just the the reversal of fortune you know that that switching things up really really good absolutely loved that and but I think you know it didn't necessarily need it to have been played as a

[01:18:06] bang here's the big twist actually yeah I mean because it just twisted itself along quite nicely but yeah and quite explicitly through the episodes but but as Chris I think you said as well Chris you know having those cliffhangers at the end of each episode to go

[01:18:23] oh something's not what it seems here you know to take you along with the mystery because that's what mystery shows do they give you something to hang on to at the end of each episode that

[01:18:33] we're the liar to get on to the next one totally agreed but what I mean is so even just bringing a play just sort of spindly hand out in episode two rather than the final episode you imagine

[01:18:45] if they did that episode two they didn't show them for six and mine's were just blown I think my point is that they should have yeah absolutely should have shown here is reasoning for being there on the screen with a spindly hand in and effectively but there was

[01:19:03] certainly end of season two that would be his two seconds at the end of season two otherwise you never get yeah agreed but Chris what did you think ever of the f-light season one I'm kind of somewhere a

[01:19:14] bit less than both of you um I'm okay to good on this so like I do a 2.5 to 3 out of 5 I went in with a lot more preconceptions of what this would be based on some of the comics and some

[01:19:27] the games and what the options of this and again as I said I thought this was going to be more and or then say say more so we just again and I'd like to soka and this was good to okay

[01:19:41] okay to good I should actually kind of brand that um I feel a lot of the points were there and as a whole when you get to the end it's good but they just missed some story beats or maybe

[01:19:55] those some weird edits or at this is what we do we talk about a lot of these shows so I don't think I'm like an expert but I'm definitely understand how the threads of eight episodes series should

[01:20:07] kind of kind of be written and kind of pointed and package I feel a missed some of those marks I agree totally Chris and if you're going to change that format no problem at all

[01:20:17] change that format that's deadly but make sure works even if you're trying to throw everything up in the air like they are at the show if you're going to throw everything up in the air to make

[01:20:26] a different show than people expect excellent but make sure it bloody works in the way you is that decide to create it absolutely I think I just I think that it missed the mark on some of

[01:20:34] the yeah I'm very much interested in season 2 that's a thing I will end my final point is my kind of wrap-up is I want to see season 2 I want to see they've set up something that's

[01:20:46] going to be good and for any game is this is a sudden creed to a sudden screen too precious is this is a new whole two empire strikes by me yeah it's something good that has the possibility

[01:21:01] to be absolutely great in the next installment and I think if they lean into the things that worked and kind of phase out of some of the things that didn't I think we're in for quite a good

[01:21:13] thing in about two or three years probably out two years but again we'll find out in a couple of days San Diego come around is in a couple of days and then D23s in a couple of weeks we'll get some

[01:21:24] form of an instrument beer grudder bad and we'll see but now the unfortunate thing is the next installment is going to be the skeleton crew and that takes us right back to the Skywalker saga here

[01:21:36] so we're going to be jumping out of the higher public for a beast a while yeah so we'll see yep yeah excellent stuff thanks so much for joining us for our podcast about the

[01:21:49] accolades I'm going to take it off guys thanks so much for joining me for this one I'm going to take it off with the rest of our fellow accolades and chat about their feedback on the last couple of episodes

[01:21:58] because then you book gotta go yes thank you so much to everyone for joining us for this beautiful discussion I can't wait to hear what your thoughts are worth fellow accolades and we'll speak to

[01:22:10] very soon in the galaxy far far away for what ever will be the new Star Wars podcasts discussions find out when we get dates of skeleton crew and or in the future who knows

[01:22:23] it's a galaxy a long time ago in the galaxy far far away has been well known there's absolutely yeah great chatting all things about the accolades fellow accolades and look at fellow accolades and make sound so important but yeah thank you so much fellow

[01:22:40] accolades for joining us for this season one discussion on the accolades yeah okay as I said the guys had to go unfortunately so they didn't have a chance to stay with us to do the

[01:22:51] feedback but I'm here with our wonderful fellow accolades with their thoughts on the accolades finale and first up Alex Bellish says I thought this was a great setup for season two I think since

[01:23:01] this is so dark in the Jedi I portrayed to me as foolish or dumb almost like stormtroopers with the way they just run in with light sappers and hand I actually started to dislike them maybe that's

[01:23:10] what they were going for since this is focused on the Sith Master of Anastra was not my favorite character but I hope season two will make her more likable it was so sad that killed every single

[01:23:19] person that we started this series with walking dead star I feel since this is not a complete show and it being Sith focused it's getting a bit of a bad rap and it's an interesting point Alex

[01:23:29] yeah like I heard our thoughts there on why I feel it was getting a bit of a bad rap as a show but there are ways that I suppose it could have gone that wouldn't have got to have a bad

[01:23:43] rap I don't think it's specifically because it's Sith focused but yeah it just felt weird that there was so many named characters just where we're killed often in one episode definitely

[01:23:53] but yeah let's hope there is a season two coming up that's a I like to explore the characters that are still alive a little bit more thanks very much for that Alex and we also got some feedback

[01:24:02] from Dr. Bob Phillips you said not quite how expected the show to turn out and that's not a bad thing with two twists the possibly seal this as a capsule story that is staying questioning

[01:24:11] the premise of the Jedi Sith binary or allowing before a season two the performance of salt tortured by a single terrible misjudgment was brilliant as was the jewel may OSHA work and sexy Sith

[01:24:22] wasn't bad either totally way to their above out of Britain said that couldn't really help themselves that last shot sigh yeah I guess that's the appearance of Yoda right at the end Jo Herber says cool lightsaber fights boss unfortunately another disappointing star war is

[01:24:39] season for me my wife doesn't usually get too agitated by shows but this finale bogter I'm gonna end it or somebody was that just made no sense I thought OSHA story was poorly

[01:24:48] done she went from not being able to use the force to save her own life early in the season to putting on the toothy helmet and bam Darth sexy can hardly get near her what happened there

[01:24:57] she went from not letting her old pal Saul kill her ampaging murder a few episodes ago to suddenly force chucking salt to death after barely hearing what happened they clearly wanted to show how she turned to the dark side but it was not well executed for me

[01:25:10] May's arc wasn't much better either she ends up only remembering when she was eight two full episodes of flashbacks and they still didn't explain to what happened to me how did she survive why didn't the Jedi apparently not try to retrieve her body

[01:25:22] how when did she meet her why did Saul make such terrible decisions back then the show didn't seem to know what it really wanted to be it was dark and violent and then

[01:25:31] it's got reset pip shooting oil and oats fit in the finale like a kid show a whole group of Jedi are following a little sniffling creature around like they're useless for their at it

[01:25:39] it has incredible fight scenes then the middle of the fun finale run kerosund introducing a senator I can't wait for a android or twitter and maybe the next season of mandal will be good

[01:25:48] here's hoping yeah seems like very very disappointed there Jo I think there there are really good things about the show but yeah there's there's a couple of a couple of things that didn't

[01:25:56] really match up to what I hope to see in a star war season definitely let's have battles were very cool but I think like they're I think you know as I say on rewatch and watching it through

[01:26:08] for the second time all in row I think it matches up a lot more closely than I thought it did the first time I watched when I was watching it week two weeks and leaving the full gap of a week

[01:26:18] between the episode so so maybe there's a bit more maybe we may have highlighted some of the things that came out of the show that may not have been highlighted as well when you watched

[01:26:26] the first time maybe that might help Joe but thanks very much for your feedback a couple of invadka sent in message to us he says check off force died ended up broken and

[01:26:36] unfired the shows premise if any lost in a blind alley the one lesson learned never bring the homesick prone or those with a paddle on fast just on an away mission cool jewels and fight scenes with excellent acting in an aimless tale two sundered sabers twisted sisters and

[01:26:53] treacherous trackers age of five oh yeah I think that's probably the lowest rating that you've given to any of the shows that we've covered a couple of okay yeah I know it wasn't

[01:27:02] really click and for you as well during the season and I'm the same it's definitely not up there with the best of the star war shows and as I say my big question in my head and something

[01:27:10] that will never really know is I wonder if they'd done a more straightforward show in the old republic with this of stood out as a better show once we had an established universe around

[01:27:19] it as it was focusing on all the characters late knowing the established universe around it at this time in the in the old republic maybe that didn't do it any favors at all. Finally Alan Thomas says I really quite like the finale definitely about who did some early

[01:27:35] episodes but not as good as episode six of the show for virgin says eight or five very good on yeah as I said I think the end worked really well for me and by the end of the series

[01:27:43] season as we got there I think it overall worked really well so glad to enjoy just thanks I pretty free feedback I know there was some other feedback that came in on each individual episode

[01:27:51] over on the facebook group as well if you want to go check that out pop up a twitter facebook group at facebook.com slash groups slash tv podcast industries or if you want to send in any thoughts that

[01:28:01] you have on the act of like you're going to always email us two feedback at tvpodcastindustries.com and you can have a chat with me guys thanks so much for joining us we will be back next week

[01:28:10] with our coverage of dead pool and Wolverine go back to the cinema to watch marvels dead pool and Wolverine look forward to that and we have just recorded and released the boys rap

[01:28:19] up if you've watched season four of the boys and we have every episode covered on tvpodcastindustries.com as well so make sure you subscribe to the podcast over there and tvpodcastindustries.com to get

[01:28:27] access to all the shows that will be covering the future but I will return to john and Chris one last time for them to say a farewell as well thanks so much john. Yes thank you so much for joining us

[01:28:38] shnickchnick yes thanks so much fellow acclites for joining us for this season one discussion really great to have this chat with yourselves until the next season of acclite remember keep watching keep listening and of course don't bleed any kibakrissels bye bye