Alien Earth Episode 5 Podcast

ALIEN EARTH EPISODE 5 TRANSCRIPT

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[JOHN]: This is the Alien Podcast on TV Podcast Industries, and we're here discussing Alien Earth Episode 5, In Space, No One.

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[TENG]: Another victory for the enemy of reason.

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[MORROW]: What does that mean?

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[TENG]: It means this space bug is proof of how stupid smart people can be.

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[TENG]: Smart enough to build ships capable of space travel, of splitting the atom and decoding the genome, but too stupid to realize you don't bring parasites home with you.

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[JOHN]: Welcome back, fellow aliens and fellow Lost Boys.

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[JOHN]: This is TV Podcast Industries.

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[JOHN]: This is the Alien Podcast, and we are discussing Alien Earth Episode 5, entitled In Space, No One.

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[JOHN]: I am one of your screaming hosts, John.

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[DEREK]: But no one can hear you, John.

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[DEREK]: I'm one of your other hosts, Derek.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, in space, no one will ever want to go again after seeing what happens to this crew.

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[JOHN]: Musk is welcome to it.

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[JOHN]: I really hope old Ocellus gets him.

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[JOHN]: Although, then he hope, no, I kind of want Ocellus to have someone nice because I've grown quite fond of Ocellus.

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[DEREK]: I've grown quite fond of Ocellus by the end of this episode, I must admit.

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[DEREK]: I hope the Zeno gets the first taste of Mr.

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[DEREK]: Musk, if he ever reaches out to his SpaceX ship.

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[JOHN]: Little musty.

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[DEREK]: If one ever gets, absolutely.

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[DEREK]: If one of them ever gets past the threshold of the planet Earth, he might be on it, you never know.

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[JOHN]: Well, he sent a car, hasn't he?

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[JOHN]: Biggest waste of time and energy that was, but-

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[DEREK]: Yeah, but it was his money, so I guess that's fine.

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[JOHN]: Crazy rich people.

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[JOHN]: Next, it'll be inbreeding, and it'll be like the new royalty.

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[DEREK]: I don't even want to laugh at crazy rich people anymore, I don't think there's any excuse for it.

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[DEREK]: I really don't.

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[DEREK]: You know, there's so many people around the planet trying to spend all of their time, you know, recycling cans and bottles, and then he goes and throws spaceships up into the air, that explode once a month, you know.

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[DEREK]: I'm sure that probably has a bit of a toll on the environment that we're not really talking about, because he's rich enough to do it for some reason.

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[JOHN]: When you put it like that, that is exactly true.

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[DEREK]: You know what I mean?

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[JOHN]: Yeah, exactly.

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[DEREK]: I presume that's having an effect on the environment, isn't it?

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[JOHN]: Yes, absolutely.

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[JOHN]: A lot of fuel being burnt to sort of break the Earth's gravity there.

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[DEREK]: And explode a spaceship, which is pretty much all that he's really achieved.

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[JOHN]: And effectively litter outer space with a car.

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[DEREK]: Yeah.

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[JOHN]: I mean, there's a car floating around now.

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[DEREK]: How did it make it out of the threshold of Earth, though?

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[JOHN]: I think it went beyond-

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[DEREK]: Oh, and then released it into the vacuum of space.

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[JOHN]: I think.

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[JOHN]: I don't know.

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[JOHN]: I can't remember now.

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[JOHN]: But let us move away from firing cars into space and talk about fires in space on spaceships.

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[DEREK]: And shooting rockets or eventually arrows back at Earth from outer space.

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[JOHN]: Exactly.

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[DEREK]: Yes, this is the big, well, I guess now traditional flashback episode.

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[DEREK]: We used to talk about this all the time when we covered our Netflix shows back in the day with Daredevil and all the Marvel shows and even stuff like Gotham.

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[DEREK]: All of the shows we cover back then, they would always have one episode of the first season that would be the flashback episode.

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[DEREK]: For some reason, we pretended like we didn't think this was going to happen.

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[DEREK]: We thought we were only going to get the information about what happened aboard the Maginot from that small flashback at the beginning of the season.

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[DEREK]: And of course, we get to Episode 5.

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[DEREK]: We finally read the title of it in space, No One, dot, dot, dot.

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[DEREK]: We went, Oh, of course, this is going to be the Maginot episode.

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[DEREK]: And from start to finish, this is the Alien Movie episode.

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[JOHN]: Absolutely, it's a great episode, just purely for bringing the Alien Movie into an episode of the TV show.

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[JOHN]: And filling in the story of what happens on the Maginot, 17 days from Earth as it hurtles towards Earth as, as you say, invariably a spaceship to a missile to an arrow.

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[JOHN]: As Schmuel says.

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[JOHN]: So yes, this was excellent stuff.

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[JOHN]: And I really can't wait to get into our discussion about it.

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[DEREK]: Absolutely.

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[DEREK]: Well, let's discuss it because it's really quick.

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[DEREK]: The details behind it anyway.

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[DEREK]: The show is based on characters created by Dan O'Bannon and Ronald Shusett, with of course HR.

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[DEREK]: Geiger.

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[DEREK]: The showrunner Noah Hawley also wrote and directed the episode.

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[DEREK]: So he has said officially that this is his Alien Movie.

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[DEREK]: If he got to direct a movie, he could do it in an hour and tell the story this way.

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[DEREK]: Why not?

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[DEREK]: If you're going to get the rights to do a story in the Alien Universe, go right back to the start.

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[DEREK]: I think they even 3D printed some of the elements of the original Nostromo ship that was used in the original Alien Movie, so that the Maginot looks exactly like the ship and they're able to use all elements of it like they did originally with the original Alien Movie.

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[DEREK]: So if you're Noah Hawley, hey, I love Alien, I can tell a great story about the Alien franchise or within the Alien Universe, but I also want to tell my version of the Alien Movie by telling this flashback episode, so he gets the writing and directing credits for this one.

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[JOHN]: Yes, absolutely.

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[JOHN]: Really, really good stuff.

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[DEREK]: And John, do you want to tell us what they gave us with your synopsis for Alien Earth Episode 5, In Space, No One, dot dot dot.

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[JOHN]: Sure.

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[JOHN]: In Space, the Uscss Maginot is 17 days from Earth.

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[JOHN]: Junior Security Officer Clem wakes Morrow from cryo-sleep and tells him there's been a fire in one of the containment rooms.

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[JOHN]: In the commotion, two facehuggers have escaped and latched upon the ship's Captain Dinsdale and Science Officer Bronski beat.

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[JOHN]: A failed attempt by medical officer Rahim to remove the facehugger from Captain Dinsdale's face has led to his death from the facehuggers acidic blood.

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[JOHN]: After being told by engineer Shmuel that the ship's navigational systems were also damaged in the fire, Morrow concludes that a crew member is either incompetent or has willingly sabotaged the ship.

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[JOHN]: Executive Officer Zavari assumes command of the ship, but Morrow threatens to relieve her if she does not prioritize the creatures above the crew.

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[JOHN]: With the facehugger still attached, Bronski is placed in cryosleep to prevent the gestation of the Xenomorph, but this fails as the creature continues to grow inside him.

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[JOHN]: In Science Officer Chibuzo's lab, one leech specimen manages to open its test tube from the inside and lays its larvae in her water bottle.

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[JOHN]: Witnessing this, the Oculus also escapes after Chibuzo fails to seal its containment vessel properly.

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[JOHN]: Meanwhile, after being called to an emergency meeting in the mess, apprentice engineer Malachite drinks the water from Chibuzo's water bottle, and the larvae calls him to cough up blood.

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[JOHN]: In the med bay, Malachite, along with Chibuzo and Rahim, are killed by the leeches' defensive toxic gas and the Maginot's quarantine procedures when trying to extract the leeches from Malachite.

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[JOHN]: Witnessing this, Zavari is in shock and Morrow relieves her of command.

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[JOHN]: After being interrogated by Morrow, creepy navigation officer Teng is killed by, now, the fully grown Xenomorph.

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[JOHN]: Elsewhere on board, Chief Engineer Petrovich is revealed to be behind the sabotage of the Maginot at the order of Boy Kavalier, who promises him a hybrid body and more wealth than he can imagine if the ship crashes into Prodigy territory.

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[JOHN]: Petrovich kills Clem and is in turn killed by Morrow, who retreats to the control room and steals himself in.

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[JOHN]: Zavari is killed by the Xenomorph outside the control room door.

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[JOHN]: With everyone dead, Morrow locks himself in the impact room and awaits the crash.

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[JOHN]: Back in the present, Morrow meets with Yutani, reiterating his promise to retrieve the specimens by force and kill Boy Kavalier.

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[DEREK]: Excellent, yes, and there we are, back on Earth at the end of the episode, back past last week's episode, and with lots more knowledge about who Morrow is and what he's willing to do to get these specimens back to Yutani.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, he really is singularly focused, is Morrow.

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[JOHN]: And interestingly, we do get that sense as to why, right at the end, as Morrow has come back in to Yutani, in order to, I guess, give a status update to the head of the corporation.

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[JOHN]: And yeah, no, I mean, it's really interesting that he was kind of plucked from the street as a boy who had a withered arm.

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[JOHN]: And I guess that is the reason why Yutani's grandmother, Lady Yutani, I guess I'll call her, said that he was ferocious in that sense.

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[JOHN]: And she was very fond of him.

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[DEREK]: And yeah, I think Yutani says that her grandmother called him the most ferocious thing she's ever seen, this boy with the palsy arm on the street that she brought in to have the treatments effectively.

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[DEREK]: That's why he is this hybrid that they sent out to space with this very specific task to bring back the creatures crew expendable effectively.

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[DEREK]: So and that's what this story is really all about.

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[JOHN]: It is like the setting on the Maginot, just really, really good.

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[JOHN]: I mean, I loved this.

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[JOHN]: I just loved the whole sort of building up of tension, pressure, horror, gore.

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[JOHN]: And it's interesting with Alien movies, you have that.

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[JOHN]: I guess that life cycle of the Alien, the egg, the facehugger, the gestation, the chestburster, and then the that kind of period of time where everyone seems to be fine until the fully grown Xenomorph sort of pops into view.

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[JOHN]: And generally by surprise, killing some unknown.

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[DEREK]: Absolutely.

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[JOHN]: And but interestingly, you do start to get at least the life cycle of the leech here as well, which again is another really interesting thing.

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[JOHN]: And I mean, they are tough little buggers as well.

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[JOHN]: And and and then you just have the wonderful.

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[JOHN]: I'm still going to call it the Octi eyeball.

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[JOHN]: And I know that they have officially called it T.

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[JOHN]: Oculus, but an Octi eyeball is just much easier to say.

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[DEREK]: Absolutely.

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[DEREK]: Just to mention, we got a bit of feedback in from Robert Logan over on over on YouTube after last week when we're having this discussion about what to name the the multi eyed creature.

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[DEREK]: And he says it's octopus.

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[DEREK]: It is an octopus.

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[DEREK]: I will not accept any other name.

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[JOHN]: That's a good one as well.

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[JOHN]: I have to say, I really do like that one.

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[JOHN]: But I just love how all of it comes together.

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[JOHN]: And I like the fact that as well, my kind of theory that maybe the crash wasn't quite as big an accident as it first seemed comes to pass.

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[JOHN]: Now, I mean, I think I was originally thinking maybe it's even Morrow just because he was so intent on finding Boy Kavalier.

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[DEREK]: Yeah.

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[JOHN]: But here we find that is another member of the crew.

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[JOHN]: But I think we should get into our points, really.

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[DEREK]: Well, exactly, exactly.

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[JOHN]: Before I start covering everything, because it's such a great episode.

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[JOHN]: I really enjoyed this a lot.

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[DEREK]: Absolutely.

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[DEREK]: Yeah, I do want to start with the Maginot itself.

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[DEREK]: You know, I mentioned earlier on that, you know, the template for it is effectively taken from the Nostromo from the original 1979 Ridley Scott movie.

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[DEREK]: They had literally gone room by room to what's available and had 3D reprinted to make sure it absolutely fit the aesthetic of the original original setting of the Nostromo.

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[DEREK]: So that's why it looks so cool and it's so recognizable as a space effectively.

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[DEREK]: And we probably should have guessed when we saw it in that initial episode that we were definitely going to get more scenes within that space as well, because you don't take so much care with so much detail for a couple of minutes on a TV show.

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[DEREK]: You have to show off what you've done.

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[DEREK]: And they do it to great effect here with every single room being recognizable as a place that we've been to before back in the Alien movie.

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[DEREK]: And I'd say we've probably seen Alien a hundred times easily.

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[DEREK]: So it felt so familiar.

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[DEREK]: And that probably what adds to the dread and terror of what's going on in the situation.

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[DEREK]: You're just waiting for those moments when someone walks around a corner, what's going to be around the corner waiting for them.

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[DEREK]: And so opening on this moment with Clem arriving in, this character we haven't met before, he wasn't in the flashback sequences in the first episode.

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[DEREK]: He's the person that takes on the responsibilities of the security role while Morrow is in hypersleep.

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[DEREK]: And he's the one that wakes him up saying, Oh, it's already happened.

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[DEREK]: There's already been a bit of a disaster.

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[DEREK]: We need to wake up the real security officer here.

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[DEREK]: There's been a fire on board.

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[DEREK]: And what does he call them?

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[DEREK]: A couple of those clam like creatures with with fingers, the ones with tentacles have escaped and the captain has been compromised.

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[DEREK]: And the first officer, a science officer has been compromised.

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[DEREK]: And I think you need to come with me.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, it's not a great wake up call.

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[JOHN]: And but you're right.

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[JOHN]: I mean, just coming back to the the Maginot as a setting, it's really, really good.

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[JOHN]: And I love how it's massive, actually.

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[JOHN]: The ship's really big, like some of those out and outside shots from space were, I think, the the fuel line is exploding out.

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[JOHN]: And you suddenly realize, actually, this is a quite huge ship.

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[JOHN]: Now, most of that might be taken up by the engines and the fuel in order to propel it forward.

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[JOHN]: But nonetheless, it's a really big ship.

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[JOHN]: And sometimes I'm like, Oh, is, you know, are they, do you really get that sense when you're inside it?

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[JOHN]: It feels very kind of claustrophobic.

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[JOHN]: And I think that's because probably the majority of the ship needs to be made up of the fuel lines and all of that, just because it's such a long journey.

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[JOHN]: It is a deep space research vessel.

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[JOHN]: 65 years, yeah.

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[JOHN]: So, I do like the fact that it's 65 years.

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[JOHN]: And I think it is Rahim who says, and I've been breathing recycled farts.

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[DEREK]: I love that he's the smoking doctor as well.

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[DEREK]: He's talking about recycled farts in everybody else.

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[DEREK]: I think there is a mention from the science officer where she's going, will you please stop smoking around me?

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[DEREK]: Yeah, this is why I don't eat in the same room as you.

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[DEREK]: And the comments about recycled farts for 65 years are kind of going, yeah, but recycled cigar smoke and cigarette smoke for 65 years also could probably piss you off.

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[JOHN]: Yeah, absolutely.

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[JOHN]: And I mean, I think actually that moves us on to the other sort of our next point, really, here that builds the atmosphere so well.

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[JOHN]: And in some ways, it's a little bit, it's distinct from the horror side of it, but it is simply the crew and the crew interaction.

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[JOHN]: Yeah.

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[JOHN]: And there's some really good elements here.

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[JOHN]: I mean, first of all, I just really enjoyed Clem as a character because you hadn't seen him initially in the first few episodes.

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[JOHN]: This idea actually that you have two shifts on board the Maginot is really good.

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[JOHN]: But I think importantly as well, you do get that sense that this crew or the two crews that operate in tandem with one another, are really held together by the contract that Yutani or Waylon Yutani give it.

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[JOHN]: And I think it is to the point of the conversation that you have through Schmuel and Malachite, the two engineers, where he says, you know, the contract is not for you doing the work.

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[JOHN]: The work here is standard.

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[JOHN]: It is partly automated.

00:17:10.302 -- - 00:17:29.942
[JOHN]: The reward of the contract, and if you forfeit any of it, which always keeps coming up, is because, and he talks about himself, we have had it from Morrow as well, but that my wife is now an elderly invalid, effectively.

00:17:30.102 -- - 00:17:31.842
[JOHN]: I am not going back to anything.

00:17:31.842 -- - 00:17:32.942
[JOHN]: Morrow is the same.

00:17:32.942 -- - 00:17:37.362
[JOHN]: We see that his daughter died at 19 in a fire.

00:17:37.782 -- - 00:17:43.842
[JOHN]: His wife then, or his estranged wife, again, has aged in the interim.

00:17:44.082 -- - 00:17:50.262
[JOHN]: And he's like, you know, Shmuel is saying, that is the worth of the contract.

00:17:50.262 -- - 00:17:58.102
[JOHN]: That's what they are paying you for, is that you leave your life behind and you miss it effectively.

00:17:58.102 -- - 00:18:00.422
[DEREK]: Like, it's 65 years of such specific numbers.

00:18:00.482 -- - 00:18:03.822
[DEREK]: 65 years is the age that most people are supposed to retire at, let's say.

00:18:03.822 -- - 00:18:08.382
[DEREK]: So you've left at year one and coming back at year 65, right?

00:18:08.382 -- - 00:18:10.882
[DEREK]: So you've missed an entire lifetime.

00:18:10.882 -- - 00:18:13.482
[DEREK]: And no matter what, you know, you're probably 20 when you're leaving.

00:18:13.482 -- - 00:18:21.182
[DEREK]: So even the youngest person that you met when you left would be at least 85 years old when you get back, you know?

00:18:21.182 -- - 00:18:22.722
[DEREK]: That's what they're paying for.

00:18:22.722 -- - 00:18:24.222
[DEREK]: And it's a really interesting concept.

00:18:24.902 -- - 00:18:41.402
[DEREK]: It's the reason why, when you think back to the original Alien, why Harry Dean Stanton character is arguing about them needing more of a share of what they should be getting for their trip out is because when they get back, there's absolutely nothing there other than what you've made on this trip.

00:18:41.402 -- - 00:18:44.502
[JOHN]: And 65 years worth of inflation, technically as well.

00:18:44.502 -- - 00:18:51.902
[JOHN]: So actually, your reward, your payment has devalued.

00:18:51.902 -- - 00:18:52.422
[DEREK]: Maybe.

00:18:52.822 -- - 00:18:53.702
[DEREK]: I think it's the other way around.

00:18:53.702 -- - 00:19:01.362
[DEREK]: I think you get back and you get paid, say, they don't negotiate what the price would be before you leave and you get back and that price is useless.

00:19:01.362 -- - 00:19:08.842
[DEREK]: I think it's when you get back, you get a percentage of what the cargo that you bring back is worth.

00:19:08.842 -- - 00:19:10.682
[DEREK]: The idea is that these are all space truckers.

00:19:10.682 -- - 00:19:14.862
[DEREK]: They're traveling around space, picking up things and bringing them back effectively.

00:19:14.862 -- - 00:19:43.942
[DEREK]: In this case, it's the creatures that they're bringing back, probably very valuable to Yutani, but all it means the lower class levels of the ship, which again, I love that they touch on the class levels of the ship, the lower class levels of the ship, like Shmuel and his assistant, they'll only get one 14th share of it, whereas some of the higher members of the team, like the captain and probably even the security officer, will get two or three full shares of of it, which is interesting.

00:19:44.022 -- - 00:19:55.422
[JOHN]: Well, that's it, but also insubordination or disciplining is based around forfeiture of a proportion of your payment from the contract.

00:19:55.422 -- - 00:19:56.282
[DEREK]: Exactly.

00:19:56.282 -- - 00:20:04.502
[JOHN]: Or total revocation of any payment as Morrow sort of threatens to Zavari.

00:20:05.102 -- - 00:20:06.982
[JOHN]: And it's just really interesting.

00:20:07.202 -- - 00:20:08.322
[JOHN]: I really do like that.

00:20:08.322 -- - 00:20:15.622
[JOHN]: And yet at the same time, Morrow and Zavari are at loggerheads with one another.

00:20:15.622 -- - 00:20:17.462
[JOHN]: And there's a real tension there.

00:20:17.462 -- - 00:20:20.182
[DEREK]: There is, but it always comes back.

00:20:20.182 -- - 00:20:31.262
[DEREK]: What I love about this, why this is the story of Morrow, it always comes back to know the first prime directive that I have is getting the creatures back, doesn't matter about anybody else.

00:20:31.262 -- - 00:20:31.842
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:20:31.842 -- - 00:20:41.462
[DEREK]: And once he has a way in almost with the new captain, with Zavari, he's effectively saying to her, I don't care what your priorities are, this is the only priority.

00:20:41.462 -- - 00:20:47.662
[DEREK]: And I have a way in to depose you as captain, to make sure that I deliver on my priority.

00:20:47.662 -- - 00:20:51.822
[DEREK]: It will always come back to me getting these creatures back to home base.

00:20:51.842 -- - 00:21:01.302
[DEREK]: Zavari is worried about her crew, she's worried about effectively her new boyfriend that she's been with for the last couple of months while Morrow has been sleeping in the cryopod.

00:21:01.302 -- - 00:21:04.122
[DEREK]: Initially, I thought that was something about the two of them had a relationship.

00:21:04.122 -- - 00:21:16.422
[DEREK]: I thought Clem was niggling at Morrow while you were asleep, she's sleeping with somebody else, but it turns out, no, that's his way in because you're not supposed to have any relationship because then you'll care for another crew member.

00:21:16.422 -- - 00:21:17.822
[JOHN]: And it's against company policy.

00:21:17.822 -- - 00:21:19.082
[DEREK]: Yeah, over the mission.

00:21:19.302 -- - 00:21:19.942
[JOHN]: No, absolutely.

00:21:19.942 -- - 00:21:38.382
[JOHN]: And I loved how, you know, that plays out in the control room where Zavari is being asked continuously by Mother to acknowledge that the priority is the cargo.

00:21:38.382 -- - 00:21:42.262
[JOHN]: And it's, acknowledge, acknowledge.

00:21:42.262 -- - 00:21:46.402
[JOHN]: If you don't acknowledge, the security officer will replace you.

00:21:46.402 -- - 00:21:49.002
[JOHN]: And she acknowledges reluctantly.

00:21:49.002 -- - 00:21:55.482
[JOHN]: I think equally you have Morrow where Zavari is saying, well, I'll go to Mother and get my directive, da, da, da, da, da.

00:21:56.282 -- - 00:21:59.942
[JOHN]: And he's like, I don't need Mother.

00:21:59.942 -- - 00:22:03.202
[JOHN]: My directive comes from Yutani herself.

00:22:03.202 -- - 00:22:04.782
[DEREK]: Yeah, you go ahead and talk to the computer.

00:22:04.782 -- - 00:22:06.382
[DEREK]: I'll be waiting over here in the security room.

00:22:06.382 -- - 00:22:10.582
[JOHN]: And it's just like that power play is really, really interesting.

00:22:10.582 -- - 00:22:11.162
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

00:22:11.162 -- - 00:22:13.802
[DEREK]: Just just this crew together is so it's so interesting.

00:22:13.802 -- - 00:22:22.902
[DEREK]: I must say, I think my favorite moment of all of them is where Malachite reveals that he probably shouldn't be on this trip anyway.

00:22:22.902 -- - 00:22:24.722
[DEREK]: He's like, I don't really know why I'm here anyway.

00:22:26.022 -- - 00:22:29.122
[DEREK]: I came to study rocks, you know, it was a biological mission.

00:22:29.122 -- - 00:22:32.462
[DEREK]: And Schmuel tells to him, no, no, this is the biological mission.

00:22:32.462 -- - 00:22:34.502
[DEREK]: A biological mission is exploring creatures.

00:22:34.502 -- - 00:22:36.382
[DEREK]: You're thinking of a geological mission.

00:22:36.382 -- - 00:22:38.182
[DEREK]: He goes, what?

00:22:38.182 -- - 00:22:39.382
[DEREK]: How do you know this stuff?

00:22:39.402 -- - 00:22:40.642
[DEREK]: He says back to Shmuel.

00:22:40.642 -- - 00:22:41.542
[JOHN]: Exactly.

00:22:41.542 -- - 00:22:49.162
[JOHN]: But it's even where you see the communication that's recovered in order to find out who is the potential saboteur.

00:22:49.162 -- - 00:22:50.682
[JOHN]: And he runs through a number of them.

00:22:50.682 -- - 00:22:52.182
[JOHN]: One is Malachite.

00:22:52.182 -- - 00:22:53.862
[JOHN]: And he goes, yeah.

00:22:54.062 -- - 00:22:59.322
[JOHN]: And I'm an engineer's apprentice, whatever that is.

00:22:59.322 -- - 00:23:00.462
[JOHN]: It's really good.

00:23:00.462 -- - 00:23:04.282
[JOHN]: I mean, even I think there's a really great moment.

00:23:04.282 -- - 00:23:07.222
[JOHN]: And it's kind of dealt with in subtitles.

00:23:07.222 -- - 00:23:09.062
[JOHN]: You might not necessarily hear it.

00:23:09.062 -- - 00:23:19.702
[JOHN]: So definitely put the subtitles on where they've been called for the emergency meeting in the mess hall, in the dining room, the kitchen, whatever of the spaceship.

00:23:20.462 -- - 00:23:24.462
[JOHN]: And he's taking the opportunity to get a bit of food in.

00:23:24.462 -- - 00:23:31.222
[JOHN]: And it's unfortunately as well where he does drink Chibuzo's infected water.

00:23:32.542 -- - 00:23:37.882
[JOHN]: And they're talking about a saboteur and he's like, is that a Frenchman?

00:23:37.882 -- - 00:23:42.502
[JOHN]: And Shmuel says it's a bad Frenchman.

00:23:42.502 -- - 00:23:49.062
[JOHN]: And I'm like, that is really kind of, it's just very particular type of humour.

00:23:50.582 -- - 00:23:57.502
[JOHN]: But again, it's just, to Malachite, it's like, how and why are you on the trip?

00:23:57.502 -- - 00:24:06.902
[JOHN]: And it inferred Jews to him, he's survived this far, because, you know, you do know that a lot of people have died getting these specimens.

00:24:06.902 -- - 00:24:07.602
[JOHN]: Yes, true.

00:24:07.602 -- - 00:24:10.802
[JOHN]: When you go back to Episode 1 or 2.

00:24:10.802 -- - 00:24:19.262
[JOHN]: I really thought he was a good comic relief in this episode, with his back and forth between Shmuel here.

00:24:19.262 -- - 00:24:22.502
[JOHN]: So yeah, like that was also kind of nice, that back and forth.

00:24:22.502 -- - 00:24:31.182
[JOHN]: I mean, even where Shmuel was, is like trying to convince him about splitting his pie in half, because he's got two pies.

00:24:31.222 -- - 00:24:35.242
[JOHN]: So like, yeah, but the last time I did that, you ate the other one.

00:24:35.242 -- - 00:24:37.102
[JOHN]: And it's like, oh, I've tried that already.

00:24:37.242 -- - 00:24:38.602
[JOHN]: It's just so good.

00:24:38.602 -- - 00:24:45.842
[DEREK]: I love it, because effectively, Shmuel knows who stupid this kid is, and he's going to try everything on him.

00:24:45.962 -- - 00:24:49.082
[DEREK]: It's just a fun relationship the two of them have.

00:24:49.082 -- - 00:24:51.742
[DEREK]: Shmuel here is a recognizable actor.

00:24:51.742 -- - 00:25:03.782
[DEREK]: He's played by Michael Smiley, who we probably know best from Spaced, the original TV show that came from Simon Pegg, Nick Frost and Edgar Rice.

00:25:03.782 -- - 00:25:06.722
[DEREK]: And then he went on and was seen again in World's End.

00:25:06.722 -- - 00:25:12.482
[DEREK]: But he's a very recognizable actor, Michael Smiley, and he's a really good comedic actor.

00:25:12.482 -- - 00:25:14.562
[DEREK]: He's done loads of other roles as well.

00:25:14.562 -- - 00:25:24.102
[DEREK]: But here just him being the most serious character to begin with, because he's the one that delivers the real piece of information to Morrow that sets him on the path knowing this is a saboteur.

00:25:24.102 -- - 00:25:32.042
[DEREK]: He's the one that's waiting outside and effectively says, someone has taken out our two most important systems, the navigation system and the propulsion system.

00:25:32.042 -- - 00:25:34.602
[DEREK]: That's pretty unlikely thing to happen.

00:25:34.602 -- - 00:25:35.342
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:25:35.342 -- - 00:25:38.382
[DEREK]: And Morrow's response to it going, we better get to work, shouldn't you?

00:25:38.662 -- - 00:25:42.782
[DEREK]: And Smiley's moment where he's trying to get across how important this is.

00:25:42.782 -- - 00:25:50.442
[DEREK]: Yes, of course, I'm going to get to work, but you need to know this is a this is much bigger than there being a release of two of two creatures inside.

00:25:50.442 -- - 00:25:53.902
[DEREK]: But we have lost the two biggest systems, which is almost impossible to happen.

00:25:53.902 -- - 00:25:54.322
[JOHN]: I love it.

00:25:54.322 -- - 00:25:59.802
[JOHN]: He says, we were a spaceship and now we're a missile heading towards Earth.

00:25:59.802 -- - 00:26:06.682
[JOHN]: But even on top of that, he's got no love for this cargo, which is totally at odds tomorrow.

00:26:06.782 -- - 00:26:17.342
[JOHN]: And he says to him, despite knowing that, because we saw that kind of interaction in Episode 1 as well, between Morrow and Schmuel.

00:26:17.342 -- - 00:26:36.302
[JOHN]: With the death of the captain, Morrow tells Rahim, the medical officer, he tells Rahim, the medical officer, to get Captain Dinsdale ready for burial at space, basically.

00:26:36.442 -- - 00:26:38.842
[JOHN]: So to fire him out of the ship.

00:26:38.842 -- - 00:26:43.882
[JOHN]: And Schmuel says it'd be better off if it was both of them.

00:26:43.882 -- - 00:26:44.522
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:26:44.522 -- - 00:26:47.402
[JOHN]: Whereas, put them both out into space.

00:26:47.402 -- - 00:26:53.802
[DEREK]: And what I love about this, because we're so used to dealing with just Xenomorphs on these spaceships over the course of most of the series.

00:26:53.802 -- - 00:27:02.542
[DEREK]: And what I love about this is, unlike most of the other, you know, one beast in a haunted house story, which is all of the rest of the Alien and Alien versus Further movies.

00:27:03.082 -- - 00:27:17.122
[DEREK]: And unlike all of those, Shmuel's advice of put both of them out into space actually wouldn't have solved the problem because there are so many other creatures on board, all trying to get their claws into the humans that are there and work out a way to keep themselves living.

00:27:17.122 -- - 00:27:19.102
[DEREK]: That it wouldn't have been the solve.

00:27:19.102 -- - 00:27:19.982
[DEREK]: He is right.

00:27:19.982 -- - 00:27:26.702
[DEREK]: If this had been the original Alien movie and Smuel had been on board and people had listened to him, that would have solved it all to begin with.

00:27:26.762 -- - 00:27:32.522
[DEREK]: If he just said, right, John Hurt's character, he can't get back on board the ship like Ripley wanted to do.

00:27:32.522 -- - 00:27:35.402
[DEREK]: You don't let him back on board, then that whole movie doesn't take place, right?

00:27:35.402 -- - 00:27:36.002
[JOHN]: Yeah, exactly.

00:27:36.002 -- - 00:27:42.282
[DEREK]: If Shmuel's looking at these two people and saying, send them off into space, that would have solved the Xeno problem.

00:27:42.282 -- - 00:27:42.602
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:27:42.602 -- - 00:27:43.162
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:27:43.162 -- - 00:27:46.822
[DEREK]: Wouldn't have solved the rest of the problem, which is kind of what leads us on to our next major point.

00:27:46.822 -- - 00:27:47.182
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:27:47.182 -- - 00:27:56.022
[JOHN]: In a slightly misleading sense, I've kind of called it a series of unfortunate events because I actually just love the way it all unfolds, actually.

00:27:56.782 -- - 00:28:13.482
[JOHN]: The timing of the events, the different alien specimens that are involved in it, plus throwing into it the actions of a saboteur that Morrow is trying to track down as well.

00:28:14.782 -- - 00:28:27.182
[JOHN]: It just becomes this really kinetic progression that just sort of barrels towards the ultimate ending that we saw in Episode 1.

00:28:27.182 -- - 00:28:40.442
[JOHN]: And I like how it does bookend with seeing the spaceship hit the orbiting satellite or space station and heading towards Earth.

00:28:40.442 -- - 00:28:48.642
[JOHN]: But yes, I mean, there's just a series of unfortunate events from that initial fire that breaks out.

00:28:48.722 -- - 00:29:02.082
[JOHN]: And I like how you have Morrow going back through the security camera footage and seeing the door to the eggs where the eggs are being held has been opened.

00:29:02.082 -- - 00:29:02.962
[JOHN]: And you see...

00:29:02.962 -- - 00:29:03.262
[JOHN]: Yes.

00:29:03.262 -- - 00:29:09.542
[DEREK]: But did you notice that when he went in to inspect the location to begin with, he walks over and closes that door.

00:29:09.542 -- - 00:29:24.182
[DEREK]: So he has an initial suspicion from the investigation he does in the location itself and then goes on to the security footage, sees the door open and is looking for what point back in the security footage that door opened.

00:29:24.182 -- - 00:29:27.942
[DEREK]: So again, I love that on screen, they're showing you his investigation.

00:29:27.942 -- - 00:29:31.522
[DEREK]: Without really telling you what he's looking for, they're showing his investigation.

00:29:31.522 -- - 00:29:32.202
[DEREK]: It's really cool.

00:29:32.202 -- - 00:29:36.582
[DEREK]: Also, that's one of the other locations, very recognizable from the original Alien.

00:29:36.582 -- - 00:29:43.722
[DEREK]: That's where Harry Dinsdanton was killed by the Xenomorph hanging from those chains that we see whipping back and forth in these scenes.

00:29:44.242 -- - 00:29:53.602
[JOHN]: Well, and you get a little nod back to that as well with Malachite, just after he's drank the dirty water, so to speak.

00:29:53.602 -- - 00:30:01.822
[JOHN]: I do like that where it's just a chain that's fallen down, but it's just silhouettes and it looks like it's fallen down.

00:30:01.842 -- - 00:30:03.962
[JOHN]: It's like it's the Xenomorph's tail.

00:30:04.022 -- - 00:30:08.962
[JOHN]: There's a nice little touch there and reference back to that from the original movie.

00:30:09.922 -- - 00:30:28.002
[JOHN]: I do like, then, that you see the facehuggers through a combination of the security footage and in-moment action, where they hug onto the faces of Captain Dinsdale and Bronski Beats.

00:30:28.002 -- - 00:30:39.742
[JOHN]: I do like the fact as well that, as you say, when Morrow is there, like, initially, I was like going, oh, there's a hole already in the floor of that room.

00:30:39.742 -- - 00:30:44.102
[JOHN]: Oh, has the Xenomorph been in there already?

00:30:44.102 -- - 00:30:49.042
[JOHN]: I wasn't entirely sure of the gestation period, or is another one loose?

00:30:49.042 -- - 00:30:53.802
[JOHN]: And, of course, that's because Rahim has tried to remove it from the Captain's face.

00:30:54.382 -- - 00:31:09.862
[JOHN]: And the acid from the actual facehugger, is pretty brutal, actually, has gone through the neck of Captain Dinsdale and then gone through the floor, several floors of then the Maginot.

00:31:09.862 -- - 00:31:21.042
[JOHN]: So I just really enjoyed this kind of sequence of going from the threat of the eggs and then being opened by the saboteur to the facehuggers through the security footage.

00:31:21.042 -- - 00:31:27.442
[JOHN]: And then you get to the chestburster, which to all intents and purposes is done off screen.

00:31:27.442 -- - 00:31:28.762
[DEREK]: Isn't this really interesting?

00:31:28.762 -- - 00:31:31.102
[DEREK]: I was thinking about this as well after watching it.

00:31:31.102 -- - 00:31:48.222
[DEREK]: You know, I think part of the failing of the sequel movies made by fans of the original two Alien movies, part of the failing of them has been the feeling that they have to hit certain beats to make them Alien movies.

00:31:48.222 -- - 00:31:55.822
[DEREK]: Well, you know, you have to have the egg opening up and a facehugger attaching itself to someone because that was the thing I saw when I saw the first Alien movie.

00:31:55.822 -- - 00:32:01.782
[DEREK]: And then you have to have the chest buster bursting out of somebody's chest to make it an Alien movie.

00:32:01.782 -- - 00:32:10.682
[DEREK]: And what Noah Hawley has done here with all of the elements, every single one of those elements has gone, well, you can just watch those movies and then come back and watch our show.

00:32:10.682 -- - 00:32:13.622
[DEREK]: And you'll know what each of those stages are.

00:32:13.622 -- - 00:32:15.162
[DEREK]: We see an open egg.

00:32:15.162 -- - 00:32:20.842
[DEREK]: We see that they've tried to detach a facehugger from their captain that's killed the captain because of the acid blood.

00:32:21.262 -- - 00:32:25.002
[DEREK]: We see another facehugger on the body of the science officer.

00:32:25.002 -- - 00:32:30.222
[DEREK]: We see his body eviscerated by the chest burst coming out of him.

00:32:30.222 -- - 00:32:33.422
[DEREK]: And then we see a fully grown Xenomorph later on in the episode.

00:32:33.422 -- - 00:32:36.102
[DEREK]: We don't see any of the steps in between those things.

00:32:36.102 -- - 00:32:39.482
[DEREK]: We see the aftermath of all of them, which is so interesting.

00:32:39.882 -- - 00:32:40.482
[DEREK]: Interesting choice.

00:32:40.482 -- - 00:32:41.562
[JOHN]: Yeah, I thought so.

00:32:41.562 -- - 00:32:42.482
[JOHN]: I thought it was really good.

00:32:42.482 -- - 00:32:48.982
[JOHN]: And I like the fact that it leaves it open then to the other lovely creatures that we have here.

00:32:49.142 -- - 00:32:56.762
[JOHN]: So like, whilst little baby Xenomorph is growing, learning to read, is wanted, you know, is time's table.

00:32:56.762 -- - 00:32:58.782
[DEREK]: Yes, learning to eviscerate.

00:32:58.782 -- - 00:32:59.302
[JOHN]: Yes, exactly.

00:32:59.302 -- - 00:33:00.302
[DEREK]: Brushing his teeth.

00:33:00.322 -- - 00:33:02.042
[JOHN]: Brushing, sharpening his teeth.

00:33:02.042 -- - 00:33:05.582
[DEREK]: Learning how to open his big mouth wide enough to let his small mouth out.

00:33:05.582 -- - 00:33:06.182
[JOHN]: Exactly.

00:33:06.182 -- - 00:33:08.942
[JOHN]: All those things that young Xenomorphs need to do.

00:33:08.942 -- - 00:33:15.242
[JOHN]: So how do you deal with small arms initially, and then you suddenly get long arms and normal arms.

00:33:15.642 -- - 00:33:20.742
[JOHN]: So all these sort of trials and tribulations that little Xenomorphs have to do.

00:33:20.742 -- - 00:33:22.482
[JOHN]: It's kind of all, you know.

00:33:22.482 -- - 00:33:24.322
[DEREK]: That will be the season two flashback.

00:33:24.322 -- - 00:33:25.822
[JOHN]: It's all off screen.

00:33:25.822 -- - 00:33:36.122
[JOHN]: Whilst we get to explore the wonderful array or menagerie of this alien arc effectively.

00:33:37.382 -- - 00:33:41.382
[JOHN]: In they came two by two and, you know.

00:33:41.382 -- - 00:33:43.082
[DEREK]: They went 12 by 12, I think.

00:33:43.082 -- - 00:33:43.982
[JOHN]: Went 12 by 12.

00:33:43.982 -- - 00:33:58.942
[JOHN]: And I think the Leechers one is really, really interesting because, you know, we saw the Leechers attack the two prodigy soldiers and sort of tap effectively into their artery on their neck.

00:33:58.942 -- - 00:33:59.162
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:33:59.162 -- - 00:34:00.242
[JOHN]: And you kind of like thinking.

00:34:00.242 -- - 00:34:03.182
[DEREK]: Take every single drop of blood out of their body in seconds.

00:34:03.182 -- - 00:34:05.302
[JOHN]: And blow up like a big bloody sack.

00:34:05.462 -- - 00:34:06.962
[JOHN]: And you're kind of like, oh, that's interesting.

00:34:06.962 -- - 00:34:07.862
[JOHN]: What are they going to do?

00:34:07.862 -- - 00:34:11.642
[JOHN]: And actually, more than likely, they were just feeding.

00:34:11.642 -- - 00:34:19.042
[JOHN]: And we kind of get that a bit here with Chibutzu, who is saying, well, you've not eaten for two weeks.

00:34:19.042 -- - 00:34:22.822
[JOHN]: Say if you like eat on this dead rat.

00:34:22.822 -- - 00:34:23.882
[DEREK]: It's her experiment.

00:34:23.882 -- - 00:34:24.922
[JOHN]: Yeah, it's her experiment.

00:34:24.922 -- - 00:34:37.922
[DEREK]: She is testing how long they can go without eating because she knows that they will instantly suck all the blood out of the rat if she puts a live one in there and then realizes after two weeks, oh no, they're actually going to eat the dead one now because it's been two weeks.

00:34:37.922 -- - 00:34:39.742
[DEREK]: They are absolutely ravenous at this stage.

00:34:39.742 -- - 00:34:51.302
[DEREK]: So if you think about it again, the timeline and where we got to in the first couple of episodes after the crash, these leeches have been starved by this science officer doing her experiments on the way back to Earth.

00:34:51.302 -- - 00:34:58.262
[DEREK]: And that led to them attaching themselves to the security officers and taking out all of their blood in seconds.

00:34:58.262 -- - 00:35:03.562
[DEREK]: That she's almost created the even more terrifying versions of these leeches.

00:35:03.562 -- - 00:35:09.702
[DEREK]: We don't know how quickly they were taking out the rats that were being put in with them, but they probably would have been OK if she wasn't starving them for two weeks.

00:35:09.702 -- - 00:35:25.082
[DEREK]: And also, I love that the payoff for the way that she's been taking, been feeding them through this container that she has, where she effectively has to tap it twice to close it fully.

00:35:25.082 -- - 00:35:26.542
[DEREK]: And we saw that in the first episode.

00:35:26.542 -- - 00:35:29.422
[DEREK]: I remember going, Oh, that's not a good idea that she has to tap it once.

00:35:29.962 -- - 00:35:30.522
[JOHN]: Closure, closure.

00:35:30.522 -- - 00:35:33.782
[DEREK]: Exactly, but the aperture doesn't close fully until she taps it a second time.

00:35:33.782 -- - 00:35:39.922
[DEREK]: I remember seeing that in the first episode when we saw her doing her experiments before going back to her duties.

00:35:39.922 -- - 00:35:41.822
[JOHN]: And it has a lid as well.

00:35:41.822 -- - 00:35:48.382
[DEREK]: Yeah, but they've been watching the whole time and they're way more intelligent than she's giving them credit for.

00:35:48.382 -- - 00:35:58.202
[DEREK]: And one of them makes its way up, finds the way to open up that aperture from the inside because she hasn't put the cap back on properly and then makes its way out.

00:35:58.742 -- - 00:36:05.482
[DEREK]: And watching the whole thing is the Oculus, the T-Oculus across the way.

00:36:05.482 -- - 00:36:07.882
[DEREK]: And it starts tapping on the glass.

00:36:07.882 -- - 00:36:14.562
[DEREK]: So this is our first indication of the T-Oculus, or the multi-eyed creature.

00:36:15.102 -- - 00:36:16.922
[DEREK]: Octi eyeball.

00:36:16.922 -- - 00:36:17.642
[JOHN]: Or octopus.

00:36:17.642 -- - 00:36:20.502
[DEREK]: Maybe a friend to humans.

00:36:20.502 -- - 00:36:22.582
[JOHN]: Or is distracting her.

00:36:22.582 -- - 00:36:27.542
[DEREK]: No, I think it's trying to get her attention to tell her, hang on a second, that leech is getting out.

00:36:27.622 -- - 00:36:28.602
[DEREK]: Why can't I get out?

00:36:28.602 -- - 00:36:28.982
[JOHN]: Maybe.

00:36:28.982 -- - 00:36:30.002
[JOHN]: Yeah, maybe.

00:36:30.002 -- - 00:36:30.482
[DEREK]: Maybe it's that.

00:36:30.482 -- - 00:36:32.902
[DEREK]: Or maybe it's literally telling her the leech is getting out.

00:36:32.902 -- - 00:36:33.942
[DEREK]: Warning, warning.

00:36:33.942 -- - 00:36:35.022
[JOHN]: Exactly.

00:36:35.022 -- - 00:36:48.342
[JOHN]: And I think the interesting thing here, though, is that in terms of the leech, the actual the business of killing those two guards or eating the rat is not actually it's it's simply feeding.

00:36:49.602 -- - 00:36:58.502
[JOHN]: They actually just lay their larval stage, they carry it with them, and they require water to do that.

00:36:58.502 -- - 00:36:58.922
[DEREK]: Yes.

00:36:58.922 -- - 00:37:02.202
[JOHN]: And it puts one of its legs onto the spilt water.

00:37:02.202 -- - 00:37:06.902
[JOHN]: So you've had Chibuzo sort of drinking her water and she spilt some of it.

00:37:06.902 -- - 00:37:16.142
[JOHN]: And ultimately, it squirts in however many hundreds of eggs or larval stages of its progeny effectively.

00:37:17.422 -- - 00:37:38.862
[JOHN]: And it's it's just really interesting because actually the horror then comes later with Malachite, who is the one that takes a sip of her water because he's coughing and choking on some food that he's done at the emergency meeting, which has also cost him one-sixth of his his contract.

00:37:38.862 -- - 00:37:41.102
[DEREK]: Yes, one-fourteenth of the contract, yeah.

00:37:41.102 -- - 00:37:43.142
[DEREK]: But what I do like, yes, that's where the horror comes.

00:37:43.142 -- - 00:37:45.602
[DEREK]: But the tension comes with who's going to drink the water.

00:37:45.602 -- - 00:37:47.522
[DEREK]: Yeah, because she brings the water with her.

00:37:47.522 -- - 00:37:49.522
[DEREK]: You know, it's right beside her the whole time.

00:37:49.522 -- - 00:37:51.582
[DEREK]: You assume it's going to be her that drinks it.

00:37:51.642 -- - 00:37:57.222
[DEREK]: But then when he coughs and he takes a drink of her water, it's like, oh, definitely shouldn't be sharing water aboard the ship.

00:37:57.222 -- - 00:37:57.822
[JOHN]: No, exactly.

00:37:57.822 -- - 00:37:58.722
[DEREK]: And now here you are.

00:37:58.722 -- - 00:38:04.942
[DEREK]: But it's one of those things where, again, if you I'm sure they've thought about it and I don't want to think about it too much.

00:38:04.942 -- - 00:38:10.102
[DEREK]: But as you say, the the leeches that come out, they touch the water.

00:38:10.102 -- - 00:38:19.542
[DEREK]: They're suddenly that gives them the little burst and then they're able to drop off their their fledglings into the water to make them grow.

00:38:20.782 -- - 00:38:30.002
[DEREK]: Human body is 80% water and the guys just drank a hundred of these things inside his body and now they're ripping from inside out effectively.

00:38:30.002 -- - 00:38:32.502
[DEREK]: That's why they're trying to help him.

00:38:32.502 -- - 00:38:44.902
[DEREK]: That's why he's bleeding from every orifice is because tons of these leeches are inside his body until they bring him to Medbay and Rahim and Chibuzo are trying to help him out.

00:38:44.902 -- - 00:39:00.202
[DEREK]: And then there comes the point when there's no help that can have that can be done for him anymore and they have to make the choice to use the ships defenses effectively to take care of this disease that's being spread and all three of them are dead instantly.

00:39:00.262 -- - 00:39:20.762
[JOHN]: Yeah, but I mean, equally, the defenses, the quarantine procedure, the defense of the sterilizing or poisonous gas to kill the leech doesn't work.

00:39:20.762 -- - 00:39:21.522
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:39:21.522 -- - 00:39:26.442
[JOHN]: So I mean, all these critters are massively robust in that sense.

00:39:26.482 -- - 00:39:26.742
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:39:26.742 -- - 00:39:38.402
[JOHN]: Like, OK, it looks like the the poison given off by the young tick or leech is the thing that ultimately kills.

00:39:39.562 -- - 00:39:53.322
[JOHN]: The three of them, and OK, and Malachite has his chest open, but you can see him going into cardiac arrest from the fact that he's also breathing in the poisonous or toxic gas that's been released.

00:39:53.402 -- - 00:39:53.742
[DEREK]: That's right.

00:39:53.742 -- - 00:39:56.562
[DEREK]: Rahim was trying to take off one of the leeches to keep him alive.

00:39:56.562 -- - 00:40:03.542
[JOHN]: It's a defensive mechanism of the young leech to release this gas.

00:40:03.542 -- - 00:40:08.462
[JOHN]: And because that gas has been released, then the quarantine procedures come in.

00:40:08.462 -- - 00:40:13.922
[JOHN]: And whether that is that all that air is sealed and the air is vented out.

00:40:13.962 -- - 00:40:16.802
[JOHN]: So effectively creating a vacuum.

00:40:16.802 -- - 00:40:18.042
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:40:18.042 -- - 00:40:27.482
[JOHN]: Or whether it's some kind of sort of counteracting gas or neutralizing gas, sterilizing gas, whatever it is.

00:40:27.482 -- - 00:40:30.722
[JOHN]: But the three of them are dead.

00:40:30.722 -- - 00:40:40.342
[JOHN]: And these leeches end up scooting across Malachite's body into the electronics.

00:40:40.982 -- - 00:40:59.462
[JOHN]: And you do see a number of them coming up again when poor Clem, the junior security officer, aka Clemidia, stop calling me that, is dead and they go into his wounds.

00:40:59.462 -- - 00:41:05.122
[JOHN]: So who knows what they're doing there and whether that's still relevant to the present day.

00:41:05.122 -- - 00:41:10.542
[DEREK]: Well, yeah, but that's where two of them came from to kill the two security guards, where it was not good.

00:41:10.542 -- - 00:41:11.122
[JOHN]: That makes sense.

00:41:11.122 -- - 00:41:16.762
[DEREK]: I think, I think hard to piece all of it together exactly as to what happened.

00:41:16.762 -- - 00:41:31.562
[DEREK]: But yeah, it's just one of those instances again, where the procedures that are in place to protect the crew didn't work, didn't kill the specimens, may have killed some of the crew.

00:41:31.562 -- - 00:41:40.362
[DEREK]: And interestingly, that's also what happens on the side of the the facehuggers that have attached themselves to Bronski.

00:41:40.362 -- - 00:41:44.942
[DEREK]: The protocol was that he was supposed to be putting cryo-sleep cryo-sleep.

00:41:44.942 -- - 00:41:49.922
[DEREK]: Yes, it puts the host to sleep, the human to sleep.

00:41:49.922 -- - 00:41:52.882
[DEREK]: That doesn't stop any of the process of what the Xenomorphs are doing at all.

00:41:52.882 -- - 00:41:53.882
[DEREK]: It may have slowed it down.

00:41:53.882 -- - 00:42:01.902
[DEREK]: We don't know for definite exactly how long it takes the gestation period from when the facehugger attaches itself to when the chest brister comes out.

00:42:01.902 -- - 00:42:03.002
[DEREK]: But it didn't stop any of it.

00:42:04.882 -- - 00:42:12.202
[DEREK]: Very quickly, after they put him to cryo-sleep, within the next couple of hours, chest busters bursted straight out of the cryopod.

00:42:12.202 -- - 00:42:27.802
[DEREK]: So it does make you wonder whether Whale and Yutani's, what's the term, the security writer or the safety protocol writer, was in on the idea that it doesn't really matter if the humans get home, as long as the specimens get home.

00:42:27.802 -- - 00:42:35.602
[DEREK]: So none of the protocols for taking care of the humans, in case the specimens broke out, none of those actually work.

00:42:35.602 -- - 00:42:36.542
[DEREK]: None of the protocols.

00:42:36.542 -- - 00:42:36.922
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:42:36.922 -- - 00:42:37.782
[JOHN]: And I mean...

00:42:37.782 -- - 00:42:43.422
[DEREK]: So is it because Whale and Yutani don't give a crap as long as the specimens get home?

00:42:43.422 -- - 00:42:50.002
[DEREK]: Or is it just that these are such powerful specimens that they didn't have any protocols that could have helped them out at all?

00:42:50.002 -- - 00:42:53.202
[DEREK]: As in, is it planned or is it an accident?

00:42:53.202 -- - 00:42:54.922
[JOHN]: It is an interesting thing.

00:42:55.162 -- - 00:43:06.122
[JOHN]: There's something there sometimes around all of this where it suggests that they have encountered these creatures before.

00:43:07.382 -- - 00:43:13.982
[JOHN]: And not just from this ship, but through the protocols.

00:43:13.982 -- - 00:43:21.142
[JOHN]: Yes, they don't work, but there's also the moment where, you know, they put it into cryo, into the cryo pod.

00:43:22.222 -- - 00:43:29.442
[JOHN]: But they're not saying, oh, but we know it can survive in the vacuum of space and the cold of space.

00:43:29.442 -- - 00:43:29.722
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:43:30.942 -- - 00:43:33.882
[JOHN]: So it's almost like an oversight on it.

00:43:33.882 -- - 00:43:39.682
[DEREK]: I mean, equally, I do think the crew know because the crew have lost other members of the crew.

00:43:39.682 -- - 00:43:40.182
[JOHN]: No, exactly.

00:43:40.182 -- - 00:43:41.922
[DEREK]: So I don't think Wayland Yutani may have.

00:43:42.262 -- - 00:43:46.602
[JOHN]: But it's the same with Boy Kavalier or the same with Yutani and so on.

00:43:48.362 -- - 00:43:53.102
[JOHN]: And maybe it's just, well, the cargo is going to be gold and silver.

00:43:53.102 -- - 00:43:54.502
[JOHN]: Maybe it's just that.

00:43:54.502 -- - 00:44:06.422
[JOHN]: Yutani is like, whatever we get, no matter how maybe useless or boring it is, it's going to be gold, pure gold, because it's totally new.

00:44:06.422 -- - 00:44:22.062
[JOHN]: But I think as well, the other side of it is even Chibuzo's experimenting with the specimens on alien species, like literally alien species.

00:44:22.062 -- - 00:44:29.602
[JOHN]: And I'm like, even her protocols, even those tubes are lax, that the aperture doesn't seem to close fully.

00:44:29.602 -- - 00:44:31.502
[JOHN]: And then like you have to do it again.

00:44:31.502 -- - 00:44:35.862
[JOHN]: And there's the lid to really make it secure.

00:44:37.022 -- - 00:44:37.402
[JOHN]: And I mean...

00:44:37.402 -- - 00:44:38.962
[DEREK]: She eats her dinner right beside them.

00:44:38.962 -- - 00:44:41.482
[JOHN]: You know, or even like when she puts...

00:44:41.482 -- - 00:44:44.182
[JOHN]: And I guess this is moving on to the...

00:44:44.182 -- - 00:45:01.442
[JOHN]: On to Ocellus is like when she puts Ocellus back into its secure wall-mounted chamber, it's not secured properly so that then it starts effectively.

00:45:01.642 -- - 00:45:14.742
[JOHN]: It felt like it was creating itself as a catapult or like a rubber band and just firing itself up onto the roof of its prison effectively in order to work it free.

00:45:14.742 -- - 00:45:22.682
[JOHN]: And I must say then, again, this is where we just get absolutely fantastic moments with this little critter.

00:45:22.682 -- - 00:45:23.862
[DEREK]: Absolutely, absolutely.

00:45:23.862 -- - 00:45:28.482
[DEREK]: But you're right, it's something about the protocols, but it's also something about the person herself.

00:45:29.742 -- - 00:45:32.462
[DEREK]: Chibuzo is the person that's responsible for all of this.

00:45:32.462 -- - 00:45:34.142
[DEREK]: It's a very small science team, it seems.

00:45:34.222 -- - 00:45:40.082
[DEREK]: It's her, and I would guess then it's Bronski, was the other science officer, right?

00:45:40.082 -- - 00:45:45.902
[DEREK]: So she was the junior officer, he was the senior science officer, he's no longer there, but she's continuing to do her practices.

00:45:45.902 -- - 00:45:50.222
[DEREK]: Maybe she depended on him to do the second check on everything, the double check of everything.

00:45:50.222 -- - 00:45:55.262
[DEREK]: But we heard earlier on in the episode, when she was leaving the room, she said, well, all the lights are green.

00:45:55.262 -- - 00:45:57.362
[DEREK]: That means that everything's secure.

00:45:57.362 -- - 00:46:07.902
[DEREK]: In this case, when she didn't seal the OctiEye up into its right place, the light was red and she still left the room.

00:46:07.902 -- - 00:46:10.962
[DEREK]: So she knew it hadn't, well, she didn't check whether it had been secure or not.

00:46:10.962 -- - 00:46:12.162
[JOHN]: Exactly, she didn't check it.

00:46:12.162 -- - 00:46:16.482
[DEREK]: So it's not just the protocols aren't great, it's also she's not very good at doing those.

00:46:16.482 -- - 00:46:17.942
[JOHN]: She didn't check it.

00:46:17.942 -- - 00:46:21.322
[JOHN]: But I do like that the Oculus gets out.

00:46:21.322 -- - 00:46:32.622
[JOHN]: I do like the fact that there is a great scene, I think, where Chibuzo and Zavari are back in that lab, and you see it under the table.

00:46:32.622 -- - 00:46:33.122
[JOHN]: Yes.

00:46:33.122 -- - 00:46:37.362
[JOHN]: It's just sort of hanging upside down under the table.

00:46:38.002 -- - 00:46:39.122
[DEREK]: Looking for its opportunity.

00:46:39.142 -- - 00:46:41.222
[JOHN]: Yeah, looking for the opportunity.

00:46:41.222 -- - 00:46:47.462
[JOHN]: There's the moment then when Clem and Morrow come in, they're fighting the saboteur.

00:46:47.462 -- - 00:46:54.122
[JOHN]: And again, you see it flicking itself around the room, and you're like, oh no, is Clem gonna get it?

00:46:54.122 -- - 00:46:56.202
[JOHN]: Or is, you know, Morrow doesn't?

00:46:56.202 -- - 00:47:03.282
[JOHN]: Or is it Ocellus that gets Petrovich ultimately?

00:47:03.282 -- - 00:47:07.482
[JOHN]: But he doesn't, he doesn't get, and but the door is left open.

00:47:07.482 -- - 00:47:11.562
[JOHN]: And it's the moment that he gets to escape.

00:47:11.562 -- - 00:47:25.022
[JOHN]: But actually, then it becomes Shmuel, who is on the wrong end of Octi Eyeball's sort of love of sockets, effectively.

00:47:25.022 -- - 00:47:25.742
[DEREK]: It's funny, isn't it?

00:47:25.742 -- - 00:47:37.682
[DEREK]: Because we, I'd specifically said that I suspect there's going to be a moment later out of the season when maybe Boy Kavalier will turn to the camera and Octi Eye will be in his eyeball.

00:47:37.682 -- - 00:47:39.002
[DEREK]: And that's basically what we saw.

00:47:39.002 -- - 00:47:43.502
[DEREK]: I must have just seen way too many 80s horror movies that that's what you expect.

00:47:43.622 -- - 00:47:50.542
[DEREK]: But it is in the body of of Shmuel in his eyeball.

00:47:50.542 -- - 00:47:53.222
[DEREK]: It is in control of his faculties.

00:47:53.222 -- - 00:47:54.062
[DEREK]: It's able to move.

00:47:54.062 -- - 00:47:54.762
[DEREK]: It's able to run.

00:47:54.762 -- - 00:47:57.642
[DEREK]: It's able to jump with this body attached.

00:47:57.642 -- - 00:48:00.382
[DEREK]: It's got full control of his brain stem effectively.

00:48:00.382 -- - 00:48:02.162
[DEREK]: And full mobility.

00:48:02.162 -- - 00:48:04.402
[JOHN]: So he gives a little snarl.

00:48:04.442 -- - 00:48:05.802
[DEREK]: Yep.

00:48:05.802 -- - 00:48:09.522
[DEREK]: But I was expecting to talk in this haughty British accent at some point.

00:48:09.522 -- - 00:48:13.962
[JOHN]: Well, he's from Northern Ireland, so he's not quite so haughty.

00:48:13.962 -- - 00:48:20.842
[DEREK]: But that's what would have been really funny if it was the arctic eye that was controlling him and made him speak in a haughty British accent.

00:48:20.882 -- - 00:48:38.282
[JOHN]: But it is interesting, though, then, in this sequence, though, with him there, because at the same time, Zavari has encountered a fully grown Xenomorph, and so has creepy Teng as well.

00:48:38.282 -- - 00:48:48.042
[JOHN]: And she has managed to kind of outrun it and so on, but has ended up on the bridge where Shmuel is infected with Ocellus.

00:48:49.262 -- - 00:48:54.722
[JOHN]: And it kind of does a sound in order to bring the Xenomorph back, almost.

00:48:54.722 -- - 00:48:55.582
[DEREK]: That's what it seems like.

00:48:55.582 -- - 00:49:06.382
[JOHN]: It felt like it was calling, or just making the noise, so the Xenomorph is, you know, what's that, and heads in that direction.

00:49:06.382 -- - 00:49:21.042
[JOHN]: But the great thing here is that through Ocellus, Shmuel confronts the Xenomorph head on, effectively, and jumps on its back, and starts biting into its neck.

00:49:21.042 -- - 00:49:21.482
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:49:21.482 -- - 00:49:23.342
[JOHN]: And I was like, wow.

00:49:23.342 -- - 00:49:25.202
[JOHN]: So this I wasn't expecting.

00:49:25.202 -- - 00:49:25.862
[DEREK]: Definitely not.

00:49:26.462 -- - 00:49:36.842
[JOHN]: And the moment where you have the Xenomorph stabbing Shmuel through the back, and then flipping him over, using its tail.

00:49:36.842 -- - 00:49:52.442
[JOHN]: But then after it's effectively killed him with his second mouth, Oculus immediately tries to attach itself into the alien.

00:49:52.442 -- - 00:49:53.362
[JOHN]: Yes.

00:49:53.362 -- - 00:49:56.382
[JOHN]: And this was just so unexpected for me.

00:49:56.382 -- - 00:50:00.442
[JOHN]: And I was like, wow, this is fantastic.

00:50:00.442 -- - 00:50:02.082
[JOHN]: This is another species.

00:50:02.522 -- - 00:50:09.002
[JOHN]: I mean, it's not that the Xenomorph is, yes, it is an apex predecessor.

00:50:09.002 -- - 00:50:09.242
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:50:09.242 -- - 00:50:11.182
[JOHN]: But it's not the only one.

00:50:11.182 -- - 00:50:12.062
[JOHN]: Absolutely.

00:50:12.062 -- - 00:50:12.362
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:50:12.502 -- - 00:50:21.502
[DEREK]: And I think we kind of think about all this stuff in binary because we weren't thinking about it back when these stories were created back in the 70s.

00:50:21.502 -- - 00:50:23.202
[DEREK]: The movie was called Alien.

00:50:23.202 -- - 00:50:24.582
[DEREK]: This is the alien.

00:50:24.582 -- - 00:50:25.522
[DEREK]: He attacks humans.

00:50:25.522 -- - 00:50:27.702
[DEREK]: He kills them all.

00:50:27.702 -- - 00:50:32.862
[DEREK]: Now we have a much more broad concept, let's say, of all of this stuff.

00:50:32.862 -- - 00:50:35.662
[DEREK]: It's not going to be a planet full of xenomorphs.

00:50:35.662 -- - 00:50:36.762
[DEREK]: And that's all that's there.

00:50:36.762 -- - 00:50:38.502
[DEREK]: There must be other things on their planet.

00:50:38.502 -- - 00:50:43.962
[DEREK]: And there's probably other things that are predators to it and that it's predators too.

00:50:43.962 -- - 00:50:48.362
[DEREK]: It's entirely possible that the xenomorphs predator is this octi.

00:50:48.362 -- - 00:50:56.062
[DEREK]: And they gathered up a specimen of each of them from one planet and put them aboard on the Maginot.

00:50:56.062 -- - 00:50:57.102
[DEREK]: That's entirely possible.

00:50:57.542 -- - 00:51:07.862
[DEREK]: And the reason why the octi eyeball goes straight after the xenomorph and is doing everything it can to attract the xenomorph and attack the xenomorph is because it's predator.

00:51:08.382 -- - 00:51:10.462
[DEREK]: It's used to dealing with the xenomorph.

00:51:10.462 -- - 00:51:11.162
[DEREK]: Humans aren't.

00:51:11.162 -- - 00:51:15.022
[DEREK]: Humans aren't used to dealing with this thing full of acid blood.

00:51:15.022 -- - 00:51:17.902
[DEREK]: Maybe it is from the same region, the same planet.

00:51:18.002 -- - 00:51:20.462
[JOHN]: I was team Occulus in that moment.

00:51:20.462 -- - 00:51:36.682
[JOHN]: I was just like, this is so cool that this little ferretty eyeball with sort of octopus legs is absolutely going straight for like no messing, no running, and it's going straight on the attack.

00:51:36.682 -- - 00:51:38.122
[DEREK]: Straight for the tina motion.

00:51:38.122 -- - 00:51:40.442
[JOHN]: And I thought this was excellent.

00:51:40.442 -- - 00:51:47.582
[JOHN]: I really, really enjoyed just this little moment of, you know, it was kind of like David and Goliath moment.

00:51:47.862 -- - 00:51:48.302
[DEREK]: Definitely.

00:51:48.302 -- - 00:51:51.442
[JOHN]: And it was just really, really well, well done.

00:51:51.442 -- - 00:52:02.182
[DEREK]: And I think it built up because we saw that original scene with the leeches coming out and the the octi eyeball knocking on the glass to potentially warn the science officer.

00:52:02.182 -- - 00:52:06.762
[DEREK]: Then it making its great escape to get its way out here.

00:52:06.762 -- - 00:52:24.322
[DEREK]: It does, OK, possess and kill one of the one of the best characters of the Maginot, but to an end, to get the Xenomorph to it, to get the T demorph, because it is a teenage Xenomorph, to get it to it, to have a battle thinking maybe this bigger body might be the thing that will help me take out the Xenomorph.

00:52:24.322 -- - 00:52:27.142
[DEREK]: And then it still goes fighting even though that body dies.

00:52:27.142 -- - 00:52:27.582
[DEREK]: It's cool.

00:52:27.762 -- - 00:52:34.942
[DEREK]: It's like you are kind of wondering, or I was kind of wondering by the end of the episode, is this going to be on our side?

00:52:34.942 -- - 00:52:43.642
[DEREK]: When we get to the end of the series, will they have found a way to communicate directly with this creature who is now on the side of the humans versus the Xenomorphs of Earth?

00:52:43.642 -- - 00:52:44.522
[DEREK]: Exactly.

00:52:44.522 -- - 00:53:01.142
[JOHN]: Yeah, I think the other side of it is that eyeballs are so delicate, it's like the idea of pins or knives going towards the eyeball, or even when Nibs presses and slightly compresses her eyeball, like that whole thing.

00:53:01.142 -- - 00:53:06.082
[JOHN]: I mean, I put in contact lenses and I don't really like going towards my eyes.

00:53:06.182 -- - 00:53:07.402
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:53:07.402 -- - 00:53:14.602
[JOHN]: And so you kind of go, okay, it's an eyeball on octopus legs, like that feels really delicate.

00:53:14.602 -- - 00:53:23.002
[JOHN]: And yet here it is, like on the attack against this sort of armored Xenomorph.

00:53:23.002 -- - 00:53:26.642
[JOHN]: And I'm like, yeah, I was Team Octi in that moment.

00:53:26.642 -- - 00:53:31.762
[JOHN]: I thought it was just really good, sort of, you know, something that you're not expecting.

00:53:32.762 -- - 00:53:33.722
[JOHN]: And it was really good.

00:53:33.722 -- - 00:53:51.222
[DEREK]: I will say, though, one of the things that we don't talk about with the Octi eyeball, because it is, so we talk about it as an eyeball, one of the things is it is a shape shifter because we've seen it with multiple eyes almost, and then it merges into one eyeball when it fits inside something where it's hiding or thinks it's hiding.

00:53:51.222 -- - 00:53:52.122
[DEREK]: It's definitely not hiding.

00:53:52.122 -- - 00:53:53.542
[DEREK]: You can always see it's there.

00:53:53.542 -- - 00:53:59.722
[DEREK]: But maybe on a bigger creature, if it was on a whale, I think we joked a bit before the Octi eyeball, could plaster itself in a whale.

00:53:59.722 -- - 00:54:04.962
[DEREK]: You may not notice it as easily as you do on the face of a human, because it's quite a big eyeball.

00:54:04.962 -- - 00:54:13.102
[DEREK]: But it's not just an eyeball, it's also got multiple eyes that merges together to try and hide itself almost.

00:54:13.102 -- - 00:54:27.722
[JOHN]: I love the kaleidoscope element of the alien as it sees the small mouth coming out to kill Shmuel and gets out the way, and then starts to attack the Xenomorph.

00:54:27.722 -- - 00:54:29.762
[JOHN]: So I thought this was really cool.

00:54:29.762 -- - 00:54:40.622
[JOHN]: I think the other side of the Xenomorph is I did like how it was reflected when Zavari sees it for the first time.

00:54:42.162 -- - 00:54:44.442
[JOHN]: Then I was like, but it didn't kill her.

00:54:44.442 -- - 00:54:49.942
[JOHN]: But then after a while, I started to think it was almost like it was playing with her.

00:54:49.982 -- - 00:54:52.402
[JOHN]: Like even just the fact that the tail...

00:54:52.402 -- - 00:54:56.002
[DEREK]: When it's chasing her through the corridors, it's staying just a little bit behind.

00:54:56.002 -- - 00:54:59.502
[DEREK]: And again, you know, this part of it, of course, is that it's only a few hours old.

00:54:59.502 -- - 00:55:01.442
[DEREK]: This is, as I say, this is the Xenomorph.

00:55:02.422 -- - 00:55:06.302
[DEREK]: This isn't the fully grown Xenomorphs that we saw in Aliens, for example.

00:55:06.302 -- - 00:55:09.842
[DEREK]: But I do think it's playing with its food.

00:55:09.842 -- - 00:55:12.042
[DEREK]: I do think it's chasing it and getting the fear up.

00:55:12.042 -- - 00:55:23.302
[DEREK]: We talked about that in the first couple of episodes, that maybe the thing we haven't really explored is that Xenomorphs are really attracted to fear and making someone really afraid by chasing them around all the corridors before pouncing on them.

00:55:23.302 -- - 00:55:28.682
[DEREK]: That feels like a real, you know, rabid dog thing to do almost, you know?

00:55:28.682 -- - 00:55:32.542
[DEREK]: And that's maybe part of the makeup of the Xenomorphs that they're exploring on the show.

00:55:32.542 -- - 00:55:33.102
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:55:33.102 -- - 00:55:34.642
[JOHN]: Or just a cat.

00:55:34.642 -- - 00:55:34.862
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:55:34.862 -- - 00:55:42.502
[DEREK]: Like, I know she's a fast runner, but I was watching it go, hang on a second, how is she staying three or four steps ahead of this thing that's pouncing back and forth side to side?

00:55:42.502 -- - 00:55:44.982
[DEREK]: But then when you think about it, maybe it is just playing with its food.

00:55:46.742 -- - 00:55:51.582
[JOHN]: So it doesn't kill her straight off and actually trips her up.

00:55:51.582 -- - 00:55:52.702
[JOHN]: It does.

00:55:52.702 -- - 00:55:55.182
[DEREK]: It takes its time with her when she's stuck outside the door.

00:55:55.362 -- - 00:55:55.902
[JOHN]: That's the whole point.

00:55:55.902 -- - 00:55:57.502
[JOHN]: It takes its time.

00:55:57.502 -- - 00:56:09.862
[JOHN]: And then in the end, as you say, you start to think back to Morrow where he says it goes off fear, or that kind of biological signal of fear.

00:56:09.862 -- - 00:56:30.062
[JOHN]: So it's almost like trying to generate a bigger signal of it, it gets it, you know, it's kind of like that feeding frenzy element that you have with predators, where they start to, you know, group together with like sharks or when the blood's in the water and it sort of feeding frenzy.

00:56:30.062 -- - 00:56:33.282
[JOHN]: So it's kind of really interesting.

00:56:33.282 -- - 00:56:37.102
[JOHN]: And I kind of like that element to this as well.

00:56:37.102 -- - 00:56:38.262
[DEREK]: Yeah, absolutely.

00:56:38.262 -- - 00:56:38.842
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

00:56:38.842 -- - 00:56:45.222
[JOHN]: And also the fact that actually it does get Teng in the end, who is the creepiest member of the crew.

00:56:45.222 -- - 00:56:52.802
[DEREK]: I was so convinced it was going to be revealed that he wasn't killed because he was the ship's synth, because he's so, so creepy.

00:56:53.822 -- - 00:57:03.522
[DEREK]: And I'm not even too sure whether I understand that whole thing of where he's being interrogated by Morrow about the saboteur.

00:57:03.522 -- - 00:57:12.922
[DEREK]: And then he says to him when he's been watching the tapes back, he says you're still standing over the crew member who's completely creeped out by Teng standing over her while she's asleep.

00:57:13.522 -- - 00:57:20.782
[DEREK]: And Teng seems to deflect that by saying, they're not always there when you think they are, which is the lead in for Morrow to find the saboteur.

00:57:20.782 -- - 00:57:26.742
[DEREK]: That even though all the equipment is saying the saboteur is in his cryopod, he's not always in the cryopod.

00:57:26.742 -- - 00:57:33.862
[DEREK]: But it was like as if Teng was saying, when I'm standing over her while she's sleeping, she's not always there.

00:57:34.482 -- - 00:57:39.242
[DEREK]: It's like he was trying to defend himself and say, you're judging me wrongly.

00:57:39.242 -- - 00:57:40.262
[DEREK]: I'm not looking at her.

00:57:40.262 -- - 00:57:41.962
[DEREK]: I'm looking at the empty one.

00:57:42.582 -- - 00:57:44.242
[DEREK]: I'm wondering why it's empty.

00:57:44.242 -- - 00:57:44.642
[DEREK]: Yeah.

00:57:44.642 -- - 00:57:45.022
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:57:45.242 -- - 00:57:46.602
[DEREK]: But it didn't come across that way.

00:57:46.602 -- - 00:57:47.082
[DEREK]: Do you know what I mean?

00:57:47.082 -- - 00:57:52.122
[DEREK]: It was, it certainly was edited to make it look as if he was really, really creepy.

00:57:52.122 -- - 00:57:55.022
[DEREK]: He's the character I wanted to see a bit more of so I could understand.

00:57:55.022 -- - 00:57:55.502
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:57:55.502 -- - 00:57:57.182
[DEREK]: A bit more of his story.

00:57:57.182 -- - 00:58:00.182
[DEREK]: Otherwise, he just comes across as a creep and I'm glad he got killed by the Xena.

00:58:00.182 -- - 00:58:00.342
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:58:00.342 -- - 00:58:02.282
[JOHN]: I mean, I would agree, actually.

00:58:02.742 -- - 00:58:04.182
[JOHN]: And maybe there isn't.

00:58:04.182 -- - 00:58:07.942
[JOHN]: Maybe I've just not really picked up on it.

00:58:07.942 -- - 00:58:08.882
[JOHN]: And maybe you're right.

00:58:08.982 -- - 00:58:14.682
[JOHN]: It is just that he is a creep and that she feels threatened by.

00:58:14.682 -- - 00:58:17.642
[JOHN]: Because you've got that sense in the first episode.

00:58:17.642 -- - 00:58:20.642
[JOHN]: And here it kind of that gets taken on board.

00:58:20.642 -- - 00:58:22.742
[JOHN]: And maybe it is just simply that.

00:58:22.742 -- - 00:58:27.202
[JOHN]: But it feels like there's more questions of being raised by Teng.

00:58:27.222 -- - 00:58:27.882
[JOHN]: Yeah.

00:58:27.882 -- - 00:58:29.702
[JOHN]: And why is he like that?

00:58:29.822 -- - 00:58:48.842
[JOHN]: You know, and and as I say, even his dealings with with Morrow, his dealings with Rahim, all these things that all it's all quite and feels very philosophical in the way he talks and the way he delivers it.

00:58:48.842 -- - 00:58:54.102
[JOHN]: And I'm still there going, yes, he screams, but do we actually see his body?

00:58:54.102 -- - 00:58:55.382
[JOHN]: So is he still a synth?

00:58:55.382 -- - 00:58:56.002
[JOHN]: I don't know.

00:58:56.002 -- - 00:58:57.242
[JOHN]: I don't think he is.

00:58:57.542 -- - 00:59:07.202
[JOHN]: Or if he is, it's a synth that wants the guilt of the flesh, and he's not able to ever have that, and he knows that.

00:59:07.202 -- - 00:59:11.322
[JOHN]: So he just creeps out by staring at this girl.

00:59:11.322 -- - 00:59:20.122
[JOHN]: I can't remember the woman's name, but I just feel there's more questions than answers here with Teng.

00:59:20.962 -- - 00:59:23.222
[JOHN]: I kind of feel I need to know, actually.

00:59:23.222 -- - 00:59:24.942
[DEREK]: Because it felt like there was an excuse there.

00:59:25.342 -- - 00:59:31.042
[DEREK]: You're actually, you think you see me looking over her, but actually I'm looking at the empty case of the person you think is there.

00:59:31.042 -- - 00:59:32.002
[DEREK]: He's the saboteur.

00:59:32.002 -- - 00:59:33.222
[DEREK]: I know all this information.

00:59:33.222 -- - 00:59:34.782
[DEREK]: You know, I thought it was something like that.

00:59:34.782 -- - 00:59:36.742
[DEREK]: Maybe he was working with the saboteur.

00:59:36.742 -- - 00:59:44.422
[DEREK]: And that kind of brings us on to that point about Petrovich, the saboteur, that there is a person responsible for everything that's happened here.

00:59:44.422 -- - 00:59:45.542
[DEREK]: He's the one that set the fire.

00:59:45.542 -- - 00:59:47.442
[DEREK]: He's the one that released the facehuggers.

00:59:47.442 -- - 00:59:49.742
[DEREK]: He's the one that's been given a new mission.

00:59:49.742 -- - 00:59:55.322
[DEREK]: And it's all tied back to that discussion about the crew and what they're being paid and what the contract is.

00:59:55.322 -- - 01:00:03.322
[DEREK]: There's a person on board, Petrovich, who's really unhappy with the idea of what he's going to get when he gets back from this trip.

01:00:03.322 -- - 01:00:10.462
[DEREK]: Shmuel had made the point that some of them don't get paid enough for living out the rest of their lives when they return to Earth.

01:00:10.462 -- - 01:00:13.622
[DEREK]: Most of them will have to take on other jobs and go back out into space again.

01:00:13.622 -- - 01:00:22.542
[DEREK]: And because you've severed ties with the connection with your family and friends by being out in space for 70 years, you probably go, right, I'll go back out for another 70 years.

01:00:22.922 -- - 01:00:28.362
[DEREK]: When do you actually go back to Earth and reap those rewards and live out the rest of your life?

01:00:28.362 -- - 01:00:30.342
[DEREK]: Will you ever get enough money for that?

01:00:30.342 -- - 01:00:38.602
[DEREK]: And Petrovich is one of these people who's realized while he's been away from Earth, when he gets back, he's probably not going to have enough to set himself up.

01:00:38.602 -- - 01:00:51.122
[DEREK]: So he's now willing when he gets contacted by Boy Kavalier, he's now willing to sell on his soul effectively to pass on these creatures to Boy Kavalier.

01:00:52.182 -- - 01:00:53.962
[DEREK]: Does Boy Kavalier contact him first?

01:00:53.962 -- - 01:00:56.582
[DEREK]: Do we know that or do we just see a bit of the conversation between the two of them?

01:00:56.582 -- - 01:00:58.462
[JOHN]: We just see the communication and...

01:00:58.482 -- - 01:00:59.702
[DEREK]: Because I just didn't even think about it.

01:00:59.702 -- - 01:01:02.962
[DEREK]: Of course, there's going to be communications from Earth into space.

01:01:02.962 -- - 01:01:16.602
[DEREK]: This is, you know, I would suspect that Boy Kavalier has hacked this Whalen Yutani ship coming back to Earth and found out there's a substantially worthwhile cargo on board or wealthy cargo on board that he wants to get his hands on.

01:01:16.602 -- - 01:01:22.242
[DEREK]: And he'll contact anybody in the crew and offer them money because that's the Kavalier attitude that he lives by, right?

01:01:22.242 -- - 01:01:31.542
[JOHN]: It is, but it's that notion of industrial espionage, you know, getting the IP, the copyright or the R&D.

01:01:31.582 -- - 01:01:32.442
[JOHN]: Yeah.

01:01:32.442 -- - 01:01:49.382
[JOHN]: And so this idea that either, you know, we don't know for sure with Petrovich because ultimately Morrow's interrogation of him is quite quick and ends off with his retractable knife in his back because he's being shot at by him.

01:01:49.382 -- - 01:01:53.102
[JOHN]: So, I mean, it is ultimately in a standoff.

01:01:53.102 -- - 01:02:03.562
[JOHN]: And I mean, in that sense, Petrovich has quite a nice line that he says to Morrow, where he says, they want their monsters, well, here they come.

01:02:03.562 -- - 01:02:14.362
[JOHN]: Which is a great line from Petrovich as he's got the tip of Morrow's retractable knife sticking out of his chest.

01:02:14.362 -- - 01:02:40.122
[DEREK]: Because even like the whole, this is the whole reason why everything's happened on the ship and everything's happened so far is because Boy Kavalier has contacted this person or at least has been in contact with this person, has made the offer to him, has set the path of the ship to come down in the lands of the Prodigy basically, and has also told him, well, if you die on the way down, because he questions that, what happens if I die on the way down?

01:02:40.122 -- - 01:02:44.182
[DEREK]: It's like, well, that's your loss effectively if you die on the way down.

01:02:44.182 -- - 01:02:46.562
[DEREK]: So that's Petrovich killing everybody around him.

01:02:46.562 -- - 01:02:48.782
[DEREK]: He's specifically guns down.

01:02:48.782 -- - 01:02:53.682
[DEREK]: Clem, I was wondering why he was going so much for this kid, why he wanted to kill him?

01:02:54.042 -- - 01:02:59.802
[DEREK]: Because he needs everybody dead so he could take the only escape pod, I guess, even though it stays on board the ship.

01:02:59.962 -- - 01:03:01.142
[DEREK]: The impact room.

01:03:01.142 -- - 01:03:08.122
[DEREK]: You know, there's only one person that will survive a crash of that magnitude, and it's the person in the impact room.

01:03:08.122 -- - 01:03:11.662
[DEREK]: It ends off being Morrow, but Petrovich wants to make sure it's him.

01:03:11.662 -- - 01:03:14.722
[DEREK]: That's why he's going around killing everybody he possibly can.

01:03:14.722 -- - 01:03:15.262
[JOHN]: Yeah.

01:03:15.262 -- - 01:03:17.462
[DEREK]: As the ship careens towards Earth.

01:03:17.462 -- - 01:03:26.002
[JOHN]: I mean, I think as well, you know, Boy Kavalier, you know, first of all, he has that quite matter of fact response.

01:03:26.002 -- - 01:03:27.842
[DEREK]: Kavalier, John, that's where his name came from.

01:03:27.842 -- - 01:03:30.822
[JOHN]: Yeah, if Petrovich dies.

01:03:31.082 -- - 01:03:38.502
[JOHN]: But equally, he is actually promising him something that he doesn't know that it works yet.

01:03:38.502 -- - 01:03:45.782
[JOHN]: And if it does, he's kind of suggested it's primarily should be done on children, not on adults, because they can't be done on adults.

01:03:45.782 -- - 01:03:47.262
[JOHN]: Because they're not exactly.

01:03:47.262 -- - 01:03:48.342
[JOHN]: Yes.

01:03:49.782 -- - 01:04:03.942
[JOHN]: And you know, it's kind of like he's just saying what he needs to say in order to Petrovich to sabotage this ship so that it ultimately lands in his territory.

01:04:03.942 -- - 01:04:04.262
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:04:04.262 -- - 01:04:13.882
[JOHN]: And that is literally it because he's he's yes, these things are there or on the cusp of them, but not necessarily relevant for Petrovich.

01:04:13.882 -- - 01:04:19.122
[DEREK]: It does make me think that maybe Petrovich did reach out to Boy Kavalier, though.

01:04:19.122 -- - 01:04:38.802
[DEREK]: Come to think of it, because remember in the first episode, we had the conversation, now we know the character's names, but we had the conversation between Shmuel and Malachite, where he was trying to teach Malachite about the fifth uprising, that the fifth person that has now formed part of the part of the corporations now controlling Earth was Prodigy.

01:04:39.102 -- - 01:04:40.262
[DEREK]: So they had that information.

01:04:40.262 -- - 01:04:43.022
[DEREK]: So I wonder if that's what it is.

01:04:43.022 -- - 01:05:00.322
[DEREK]: Petrovich has learned that Boy Kavalier and Prodigy have started to create these beings, these creatures who are at least, he could have his consciousness transferred into the body if he gives them to Boy Kavalier, because he says when he gets back to Earth, he's going to be old.

01:05:00.322 -- - 01:05:07.462
[DEREK]: Yes, Boy Kavalier can give him more money than he can possibly imagine, but he has no relatives, he has no descendants, he has nobody that would pass on the money to.

01:05:08.142 -- - 01:05:13.542
[DEREK]: So he wants a body that will live on while he's able to spend the money that he's getting as well.

01:05:13.542 -- - 01:05:20.762
[DEREK]: So he gets the offer of the two things, it's more wealth that he can possibly imagine, and also a body that will allow him to spend the money that he gets to.

01:05:20.762 -- - 01:05:30.762
[DEREK]: That's kind of the two things he wants, because he doesn't really want to go back, have 10 more years of life and live him out with money, he wants both things.

01:05:31.502 -- - 01:05:33.462
[DEREK]: So I think that might be it, that's the explanation.

01:05:34.122 -- - 01:05:36.602
[DEREK]: I think he's the one that contacted Boy Kavalier then.

01:05:37.102 -- - 01:05:45.222
[DEREK]: And just the glee on Boy Kavalier's face, that he may be getting a glimpse into all the stuff that Whale and Yutani have access to.

01:05:45.222 -- - 01:05:57.822
[DEREK]: And as we keep saying, you know, all the rest of the Alien movies are sequels, and we've never heard of Boy Kavalier, we've never heard of Prodigy again, we've heard of Whale and Yutani, so this is the worst decision Boy Kavalier ever made.

01:05:57.822 -- - 01:06:02.142
[DEREK]: And probably ended Prodigy as we get that story told over the next season.

01:06:02.142 -- - 01:06:04.742
[JOHN]: I guess so, but then we haven't heard of the other ones either.

01:06:05.482 -- - 01:06:12.182
[DEREK]: Well, exactly, we haven't heard of the other ones, because there's a commitment made at the end of this episode.

01:06:12.182 -- - 01:06:16.562
[DEREK]: The final point that we have, which is Morrow returning to Whale and Yutani.

01:06:16.562 -- - 01:06:24.722
[DEREK]: It's a short point, a short moment, we've already talked about the full backstory of Morrow as laid bare in this episode.

01:06:24.722 -- - 01:06:33.642
[DEREK]: He was a kid with palsy in one arm, taken from the streets given the enhancements by Grandma Yutani, sent out into space on this mission.

01:06:33.762 -- - 01:06:44.162
[DEREK]: His mission is to bring back the creatures, and he comes back talking to this granddaughter in Yutani, saying to her, do not deal with Boy Kavalier.

01:06:44.162 -- - 01:06:45.382
[DEREK]: I know what he's like now.

01:06:46.022 -- - 01:06:47.442
[DEREK]: Your lawyers will do nothing.

01:06:47.442 -- - 01:06:49.562
[DEREK]: You need an army to go in there.

01:06:49.562 -- - 01:06:56.322
[DEREK]: I will absolutely guarantee you will get all of your creatures back, and I will kill Boy Kavalier as well.

01:06:56.322 -- - 01:07:04.662
[JOHN]: And he says, unless by lawyers you mean soldiers, we have to do it my way to Yutani.

01:07:04.662 -- - 01:07:12.122
[JOHN]: And that is ultimately infiltrate and kill the Boy Kavalier.

01:07:12.122 -- - 01:07:14.702
[JOHN]: Because she goes, well, he's agreed to arbitration.

01:07:14.702 -- - 01:07:16.702
[JOHN]: It's in the hands of the lawyers now.

01:07:16.702 -- - 01:07:19.162
[JOHN]: And then she says, give him what he wants.

01:07:19.162 -- - 01:07:19.982
[DEREK]: Exactly.

01:07:19.982 -- - 01:07:20.402
[DEREK]: Exactly.

01:07:20.402 -- - 01:07:21.762
[DEREK]: So she'll probably keep up the cover story.

01:07:21.762 -- - 01:07:27.842
[DEREK]: I'll say we'll probably will have a little legal negotiation between Yutani and Kavalier next week as maybe cover.

01:07:28.762 -- - 01:07:44.862
[DEREK]: Because if you remember his discussion that he had with Slytely, when he's getting Slytely to put a human's face in front of the egg that's there in the prodigy Neverland, he has told him he will find his way in there.

01:07:44.862 -- - 01:07:53.702
[DEREK]: So Morrow has a plan for getting in there and getting out with the creatures by the relationship and the conversations he's had with Slytely.

01:07:53.702 -- - 01:07:54.502
[DEREK]: So this is his way in.

01:07:55.622 -- - 01:08:01.142
[DEREK]: Maybe, as I say, with the cover story that Yutani is going to meet up with Kavalier, or at least the lawyers are going to meet up.

01:08:01.142 -- - 01:08:05.882
[DEREK]: And while he's in there, he's going to hopefully, in his mind, take care of Boy Kavalier as well.

01:08:05.882 -- - 01:08:06.282
[JOHN]: Yeah.

01:08:06.282 -- - 01:08:22.802
[JOHN]: And yet, Kersh does know about not necessarily the plan with Yutani, but he knows about his infiltration into the mind and audio devices of Slytely.

01:08:22.942 -- - 01:08:23.142
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:08:23.142 -- - 01:08:24.302
[DEREK]: Kersh knows about everything.

01:08:24.302 -- - 01:08:26.742
[DEREK]: He's been able to listen in and watch it all.

01:08:26.742 -- - 01:08:33.102
[DEREK]: And you do wonder, again, as we mentioned, Boy Kavalier has everybody in front of a camera.

01:08:33.102 -- - 01:08:37.542
[DEREK]: So what Kersh knows, Boy Kavalier knows, I guess?

01:08:37.542 -- - 01:08:38.742
[JOHN]: Yeah, absolutely.

01:08:38.742 -- - 01:08:39.782
[JOHN]: Potentially.

01:08:40.042 -- - 01:08:40.782
[DEREK]: It's a possibility.

01:08:40.782 -- - 01:08:43.082
[DEREK]: He said, always think of me as someone that's one step ahead.

01:08:43.082 -- - 01:08:47.362
[DEREK]: So I guess we'll see how that plays out as we go on.

01:08:47.362 -- - 01:08:48.822
[DEREK]: But John, any other notes?

01:08:48.822 -- - 01:08:50.802
[DEREK]: Any other things that we haven't talked about at all?

01:08:50.802 -- - 01:08:51.522
[JOHN]: Not really.

01:08:51.622 -- - 01:08:54.882
[JOHN]: I mean, possibly I've missed something for sure.

01:08:54.882 -- - 01:08:58.742
[JOHN]: But I think this is just a really good episode.

01:08:58.742 -- - 01:09:02.582
[JOHN]: And I have no more notes at all here.

01:09:02.582 -- - 01:09:07.922
[JOHN]: I think from start to end, this is a real class episode.

01:09:07.922 -- - 01:09:13.322
[JOHN]: And it's full of tension, full of pressure, full of action.

01:09:13.322 -- - 01:09:13.882
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:09:13.882 -- - 01:09:24.202
[JOHN]: And it reveals more about some of the main characters here or reconfirms just how obnoxious they are in relation to Boy Kavalier.

01:09:24.202 -- - 01:09:31.042
[JOHN]: So yeah, like for me, I would give this five Xenomals out of five.

01:09:32.202 -- - 01:09:36.542
[JOHN]: I just think it was really, really cool.

01:09:36.542 -- - 01:09:39.382
[JOHN]: I enjoyed every minute of this.

01:09:39.382 -- - 01:09:42.542
[JOHN]: Not just the Xenomorph stuff, but the new creatures as well.

01:09:43.882 -- - 01:09:50.242
[JOHN]: And the sort of just the interactions of the crew.

01:09:50.242 -- - 01:09:57.442
[JOHN]: You know, that notion of being, you know, as Rahim says, stuck in a metal tube for 65 years, breathing recycled farts.

01:09:57.442 -- - 01:10:00.462
[JOHN]: Just the pressure of that in and of itself.

01:10:00.462 -- - 01:10:02.282
[DEREK]: Bad enough doing a flight to New Zealand.

01:10:02.282 -- - 01:10:02.902
[JOHN]: Exactly.

01:10:02.902 -- - 01:10:10.722
[JOHN]: I mean, even Zavari and Bronski, they had a sexual relationship just because you get lonely out here.

01:10:10.862 -- - 01:10:14.582
[JOHN]: It's, you know, it's so long.

01:10:14.582 -- - 01:10:16.122
[JOHN]: It's so isolating.

01:10:16.122 -- - 01:10:16.902
[JOHN]: Yeah.

01:10:16.902 -- - 01:10:24.362
[JOHN]: And I love how that just you see, you know, in some cases, it's just that the crew gets on one another's nerves.

01:10:24.362 -- - 01:10:27.322
[JOHN]: It's, you know, is Teng the way he is?

01:10:27.322 -- - 01:10:35.542
[JOHN]: Because, well, they're in the 65th year of this and he's just gone bananas and obsessive or whatever.

01:10:35.542 -- - 01:10:56.002
[JOHN]: And then you have Malachite and Shmuel, which I just thought were great, in a sense, light relief, even though Shmuel also isn't and is the first human to have been connected in with the old and mighty Teoculus.

01:10:56.002 -- - 01:11:02.202
[JOHN]: And that is just the Xenomorph coming up against little Teoculus there.

01:11:02.202 -- - 01:11:07.182
[JOHN]: And even Shmuel there is unexpected.

01:11:07.282 -- - 01:11:10.562
[JOHN]: And I really found it very, very satisfying.

01:11:10.582 -- - 01:11:14.802
[JOHN]: So, yeah, five Xenomals out of five.

01:11:14.802 -- - 01:11:16.442
[DEREK]: Fantastic, fantastic.

01:11:16.442 -- - 01:11:24.342
[DEREK]: Just a couple of tiny things that I want to mention, just a really loved Babou Ceesay's performance as Morrow here once again.

01:11:24.342 -- - 01:11:38.002
[DEREK]: I know he's been great all the way through the season, but the balance that he has to strike here between this very driven security officer who has to occasionally neglect the humans on board the ship to get his job done.

01:11:38.002 -- - 01:11:43.222
[DEREK]: But he's also giving them all opportunities to get home alive.

01:11:43.222 -- - 01:11:46.202
[DEREK]: But that's not his focus.

01:11:46.202 -- - 01:11:49.262
[DEREK]: His focus is getting the ship back with the specimens there.

01:11:49.262 -- - 01:11:56.442
[DEREK]: But if everybody tells him what they know as quickly as possible, there is a possibility that a lot more people would be alive by the end of this.

01:11:56.442 -- - 01:12:01.922
[DEREK]: Yeah, that's where we could be with what he's doing.

01:12:01.922 -- - 01:12:06.782
[DEREK]: It's only when he has to throw his hands up in the air and go, Look, everybody else is unsavable.

01:12:06.782 -- - 01:12:09.542
[DEREK]: I'm going to have to save myself and put myself into the impact room.

01:12:09.542 -- - 01:12:13.002
[DEREK]: That's when he makes his choice and moves away from everybody else.

01:12:13.002 -- - 01:12:14.142
[DEREK]: I think that's really good.

01:12:14.142 -- - 01:12:16.362
[DEREK]: I love the little touches of characters that we have in here.

01:12:16.362 -- - 01:12:22.422
[DEREK]: You mentioned the relationship between the new captain, Zavari and the science officer, Bronski.

01:12:22.422 -- - 01:12:28.102
[DEREK]: I like that we have a moment where we see him messaging home saying, I've fallen in love with someone here.

01:12:28.102 -- - 01:12:34.442
[DEREK]: The fact that she is using sand from home to calm herself down in moments of massive stress.

01:12:34.442 -- - 01:12:40.682
[DEREK]: She's the third most senior officer aboard the ship, because the captain was there and the lead science officer was there.

01:12:40.682 -- - 01:12:54.282
[DEREK]: She would have been third in line for command, and now she's in command in the most terrifying situation with a security officer is instantly telling her, I'm going to take away your security, your leadership because you fell in love with someone aboard the ship.

01:12:54.282 -- - 01:12:59.822
[DEREK]: I love those little touches because this is only an hour and five minutes, and most Alien movies are two hours.

01:12:59.822 -- - 01:13:02.222
[DEREK]: We got a lot more in those movies.

01:13:02.762 -- - 01:13:14.022
[DEREK]: But he's distilled all of the crew down into really interesting characters and had lots of tension and had lots of exciting moments and not just with the Xenomorph, also with the other creatures that we have aboard.

01:13:14.022 -- - 01:13:18.182
[DEREK]: And it all plays in really well with the story that has been taking place on Earth for the last four episodes.

01:13:18.182 -- - 01:13:19.922
[DEREK]: So really enjoyed this one.

01:13:19.922 -- - 01:13:27.582
[DEREK]: Really excited to see how the rest of the season plays out now in the knowledge of what Morrow has gone through so far and what he's willing to go through now as well.

01:13:27.622 -- - 01:13:29.242
[DEREK]: Really good, really good.

01:13:29.242 -- - 01:13:31.222
[JOHN]: Excellent, excellent.

01:13:31.222 -- - 01:13:33.142
[JOHN]: Shall we get into some feedback?

01:13:33.142 -- - 01:13:34.662
[DEREK]: Absolutely, yes.

01:13:34.662 -- - 01:13:38.762
[JOHN]: Yes, fellow aliens and fellow Lost Boys.

01:13:39.902 -- - 01:13:49.042
[JOHN]: First up, we have a message on last week's episode from Sam Lowe who says, Whoa, MAMA themed storylines.

01:13:49.042 -- - 01:13:53.302
[JOHN]: Xenomorphs are being born and apparently adopted by hybrids.

01:13:53.842 -- - 01:13:57.542
[JOHN]: A hybrid is trauma manifesting a pregnancy.

01:13:57.542 -- - 01:14:02.302
[JOHN]: Dame Sylvia almost ends her own road to motherhood with these kids.

01:14:02.302 -- - 01:14:06.062
[JOHN]: And Kid K clearly has mommy issues.

01:14:06.062 -- - 01:14:09.462
[JOHN]: So much to unpack in this great episode.

01:14:09.462 -- - 01:14:16.182
[JOHN]: Morrow went full child predator by threatening Paul Slightly's family in order to make the kid do what he wants.

01:14:16.182 -- - 01:14:21.482
[JOHN]: I'm so curious what Kirsch is thinking, processing, planning with all of this.

01:14:22.302 -- - 01:14:34.182
[JOHN]: Nibs is a great televised example of what happens when we parentify young children, treat them like adults, traumatise them, and don't nurture, comfort them after.

01:14:34.182 -- - 01:14:38.102
[JOHN]: Awful, and probably not going to end well for her either.

01:14:38.102 -- - 01:14:43.882
[JOHN]: So I'm just going to spend every episode of this show worrying about when Joe is going to die.

01:14:43.882 -- - 01:14:48.322
[JOHN]: I mean, everyone but the hybrids probably die in the end.

01:14:48.902 -- - 01:14:58.082
[JOHN]: In the other movies, there's no mention of them, these events are all prodigy, so the metaphorical cat was out of the bag before the series.

01:14:58.082 -- - 01:15:01.322
[JOHN]: Speaking of, stop killing animals.

01:15:01.322 -- - 01:15:03.002
[JOHN]: Go back to humans.

01:15:03.002 -- - 01:15:04.042
[JOHN]: But not Joe.

01:15:04.042 -- - 01:15:07.042
[JOHN]: I can't wait to hear the podcast.

01:15:07.042 -- - 01:15:08.402
[DEREK]: Excellent stuff Sam.

01:15:08.402 -- - 01:15:09.742
[JOHN]: Yeah, thanks Sam.

01:15:09.742 -- - 01:15:11.522
[DEREK]: I guess happy with this week's episode.

01:15:11.522 -- - 01:15:14.522
[DEREK]: Not many animals at all killed in this episode.

01:15:14.522 -- - 01:15:15.642
[JOHN]: Other than humans.

01:15:15.642 -- - 01:15:17.302
[DEREK]: All humans this time.

01:15:17.302 -- - 01:15:17.842
[JOHN]: Well, that's true.

01:15:17.942 -- - 01:15:19.122
[JOHN]: Apart from Morrow.

01:15:19.122 -- - 01:15:19.722
[DEREK]: Apart from Morrow.

01:15:19.722 -- - 01:15:20.602
[DEREK]: He wasn't killed.

01:15:20.602 -- - 01:15:21.682
[DEREK]: He's alive.

01:15:21.682 -- - 01:15:22.422
[DEREK]: Exactly.

01:15:22.422 -- - 01:15:23.522
[JOHN]: Apart from Morrow.

01:15:23.522 -- - 01:15:24.342
[DEREK]: Yes, sorry.

01:15:24.342 -- - 01:15:24.782
[DEREK]: Yes.

01:15:24.782 -- - 01:15:26.062
[DEREK]: So all humans killed this time.

01:15:26.062 -- - 01:15:30.322
[DEREK]: So yes, we did have to have a sacrifice of one sheep last week.

01:15:30.322 -- - 01:15:33.682
[DEREK]: Although maybe Arkti has kept him alive inside.

01:15:33.682 -- - 01:15:34.642
[DEREK]: No, probably not.

01:15:34.642 -- - 01:15:35.682
[DEREK]: Probably not.

01:15:35.682 -- - 01:15:41.302
[JOHN]: At least in a corporal sense, I guess, in a physical sense.

01:15:41.702 -- - 01:15:43.282
[DEREK]: When does a sheep stop being a sheep?

01:15:43.282 -- - 01:15:44.002
[DEREK]: Is that the question?

01:15:44.002 -- - 01:15:47.522
[JOHN]: I mean, I guess there's not much going on in a sheep's brain.

01:15:49.282 -- - 01:15:56.002
[JOHN]: Anyway, well, given they can roll over and die because they can't get back on their hooves.

01:15:56.002 -- - 01:15:57.222
Yeah.

01:15:57.222 -- - 01:16:07.842
[JOHN]: Anyway, so I guess Arkti Eyeball is not going to learn too much other than that crows are not friends of sheep when they're on their back.

01:16:07.842 -- - 01:16:08.642
[DEREK]: Well, true.

01:16:08.642 -- - 01:16:09.402
[DEREK]: Yes, yes.

01:16:09.402 -- - 01:16:17.222
[DEREK]: But it was another moment when he realized that he can make something stand on its hind legs, just like he did here with Shmuel.

01:16:17.562 -- - 01:16:18.582
[JOHN]: Yeah, exactly.

01:16:18.582 -- - 01:16:18.842
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:16:18.842 -- - 01:16:21.762
[DEREK]: So I guess he's learned that from before.

01:16:21.762 -- - 01:16:41.702
[DEREK]: But you're totally right that last week's episode, you know, the idea of having Nibs as a character, believing that she has a child, that she's pregnant inside, you know, that is talking about what has been done to her in such an interesting way without really speaking to it.

01:16:41.702 -- - 01:16:51.322
[DEREK]: She's been completely neglected, been put in an adult body, been treated like an adult, all of them put into really dangerous situations and they're all eight, nine, 10, 11, 12 years old.

01:16:51.322 -- - 01:16:56.562
[DEREK]: And, you know, it can't be overstated that they were all going through terminal illnesses.

01:16:56.562 -- - 01:17:04.742
[DEREK]: So in some cases, they may have all been almost institutionalized in hospitals for three or four years and traumatized by all of that.

01:17:04.742 -- - 01:17:06.162
[DEREK]: And then just left alone.

01:17:06.162 -- - 01:17:07.162
[DEREK]: No family, no friends.

01:17:07.222 -- - 01:17:20.262
[DEREK]: And we just talked to accept each other about the situation and having someone like Boy Kavalier telling them all that they're all just just data being transferred into a body, you know, that's got to traumatize them.

01:17:20.262 -- - 01:17:26.602
[DEREK]: And she also had the most traumatic experience, which was being attacked, she thought, by Octi eyeball.

01:17:26.602 -- - 01:17:28.862
[DEREK]: You know, that's a nine, 10 year old kid.

01:17:29.322 -- - 01:17:31.142
[JOHN]: Yeah, exactly, exactly.

01:17:31.142 -- - 01:17:32.522
[DEREK]: And I wonder she's going through what's going through.

01:17:32.522 -- - 01:17:33.842
[JOHN]: Definitely.

01:17:33.842 -- - 01:17:40.062
[JOHN]: I hope as well, Sam, you enjoyed the podcast and I hope you enjoyed this week's episode as well.

01:17:40.062 -- - 01:17:42.442
[JOHN]: So yeah, keep sending in your thoughts.

01:17:42.442 -- - 01:17:45.282
[JOHN]: It's really, really appreciated.

01:17:45.282 -- - 01:17:46.062
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:17:46.062 -- - 01:17:51.162
[DEREK]: We also got an email in from Coffee and Vodka, who says, greetings fellow final flight defenders.

01:17:51.162 -- - 01:17:53.802
[DEREK]: How do you honor the original without copying the original?

01:17:53.802 -- - 01:17:57.262
[DEREK]: You turn the Xenomorph into an almost buried lead.

01:17:57.262 -- - 01:18:04.202
[DEREK]: Betwixt a couple bugs, a saboteur, a pervy lurker, a tunnel vision cyborg and a ship hurtling rudderless to Earth.

01:18:04.202 -- - 01:18:12.222
[DEREK]: However, I still found the most murder worthy threat to be Malachite, zero impulse control and calcified stupidity.

01:18:12.222 -- - 01:18:19.022
[DEREK]: On a more positive note, it slotted in perfectly to the story and place Boy Provocateur right at the center of the plot.

01:18:19.022 -- - 01:18:24.722
[DEREK]: Not that I'm on anyone's side in this, but I cannot wait for Morrow to get armied up and spank Kavalier.

01:18:24.942 -- - 01:18:31.442
[DEREK]: But good, 5 Tengites, Catatonic Captains, and extraterrestrial tussles out of 5.

01:18:31.442 -- - 01:18:33.522
[DEREK]: Peace and take care, Coffee and Vodka.

01:18:33.522 -- - 01:18:35.842
[JOHN]: Good stuff, Coffee and Vodka.

01:18:35.842 -- - 01:18:41.902
[JOHN]: Yes, I think we're all looking to see how Kavalier ends up here.

01:18:41.902 -- - 01:18:51.602
[JOHN]: And isn't that just a great indication of how this character has been portrayed really by Samuel Blenkin?

01:18:51.602 -- - 01:18:53.982
[JOHN]: He's just so obnoxious.

01:18:54.182 -- - 01:18:55.842
[DEREK]: He just absorbs all the hate.

01:18:55.842 -- - 01:19:03.042
[DEREK]: And exactly to Coffee and Vodka's point, I'm not on any side here, except for the kids.

01:19:03.042 -- - 01:19:04.622
[DEREK]: I want the kids to get out alive, obviously.

01:19:04.622 -- - 01:19:12.662
[DEREK]: But if they die or if we learn that they are just data in the body of synths and they perish by the end of the series, that's awful.

01:19:12.662 -- - 01:19:15.662
[DEREK]: But it is Boy Kavalier that you want to die.

01:19:15.662 -- - 01:19:17.462
[DEREK]: I'm not on Morrow's side, definitely.

01:19:17.522 -- - 01:19:19.282
[DEREK]: I'm not on Kersh's side either.

01:19:19.282 -- - 01:19:22.142
[DEREK]: I'm not on anybody's side here.

01:19:22.142 -- - 01:19:27.182
[DEREK]: But I do want to see Boy Kavalier get what's coming to him.

01:19:27.782 -- - 01:19:32.022
[JOHN]: And I mean, I kind of was on Malachite's side.

01:19:32.022 -- - 01:19:33.722
[JOHN]: I had a little soft spot for him.

01:19:33.722 -- - 01:19:40.642
[JOHN]: I know you're absolutely right about the impulse control and the stupidity, but I don't know.

01:19:40.642 -- - 01:19:42.222
[JOHN]: There was something there.

01:19:42.222 -- - 01:19:46.682
[JOHN]: I know they go into cryopods and cryosleep for the long journeys.

01:19:47.322 -- - 01:19:54.002
[JOHN]: It's 65 years, but how old was he when he started?

01:19:54.002 -- - 01:19:58.782
[JOHN]: Because there will be a few birthdays that he would have had whilst on the ship.

01:19:59.202 -- - 01:19:59.962
[JOHN]: Oh, absolutely.

01:19:59.962 -- - 01:20:10.102
[JOHN]: And you have Shmuel trying to give him some classes around certain things, but even that mix up around biology and geology.

01:20:10.482 -- - 01:20:11.622
[DEREK]: It's quite a massive mix up.

01:20:11.622 -- - 01:20:13.282
[JOHN]: It is a huge mix up.

01:20:13.282 -- - 01:20:20.282
[JOHN]: But is it just inherent stupidity or is it that actually, because he's been schooled whilst on the ship?

01:20:20.282 -- - 01:20:20.722
[JOHN]: I don't know.

01:20:20.722 -- - 01:20:21.262
[DEREK]: It's entirely possible.

01:20:21.442 -- - 01:20:22.962
[JOHN]: I do have a soft spot for him.

01:20:22.962 -- - 01:20:26.162
[DEREK]: Like, I don't think he's out of the cryopods for 65 years, of course.

01:20:26.442 -- - 01:20:33.262
[DEREK]: That's not the case, but I do wonder whether he was supposed to be spending much more time out of the pod than Shmuel was.

01:20:33.262 -- - 01:20:39.382
[DEREK]: You know, he would take on more shifts because he's younger and he would live more life on the ship than in the cryopods.

01:20:39.662 -- - 01:20:45.002
[DEREK]: And maybe that was the same with Clem, the second in command for the security officer, that he was much younger as well.

01:20:45.002 -- - 01:20:49.542
[DEREK]: And he was supposed to be living more time outside of the cryopods than Morrow was, for example.

01:20:49.542 -- - 01:20:50.322
[JOHN]: Yeah, that's true.

01:20:50.322 -- - 01:20:55.802
[DEREK]: So to them, it's only five or six years away, whereas to the kids, they're away for five or ten years.

01:20:55.802 -- - 01:20:56.162
[DEREK]: You know?

01:20:56.162 -- - 01:20:56.382
[JOHN]: Yeah.

01:20:56.382 -- - 01:21:10.002
[JOHN]: And I also, I think, had a soft spot for Malachite because he was funny and the interaction between him and Shmuel was just really good.

01:21:10.002 -- - 01:21:10.782
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:21:10.782 -- - 01:21:11.522
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:21:11.522 -- - 01:21:12.122
[JOHN]: Great stuff.

01:21:12.122 -- - 01:21:13.322
[JOHN]: Thanks, Coffee and Vodka.

01:21:13.322 -- - 01:21:14.162
[DEREK]: Thanks, Coffee and Vodka.

01:21:14.162 -- - 01:21:15.902
[JOHN]: Over on Facebook, Dr.

01:21:15.902 -- - 01:21:22.262
[JOHN]: Bob Phillips says, I now can't wait for the Boy K to get justice served upon him.

01:21:23.442 -- - 01:21:35.842
[JOHN]: Brilliantly placed flashback episode, giving us peeks into the life cycle of the aliens without any sort of exposition dump, and heightening the pathos of the ship-wide slaughter.

01:21:35.842 -- - 01:21:37.482
[JOHN]: Battle of Alien vs.

01:21:37.482 -- - 01:21:40.322
[JOHN]: Octo Orb, I did not expect.

01:21:40.322 -- - 01:21:46.222
[JOHN]: But why shouldn't two utterly different predatory creatures find each other fairly annoying?

01:21:46.222 -- - 01:21:48.742
[JOHN]: Also cryopod design?

01:21:48.742 -- - 01:21:54.822
[JOHN]: Dignity could have been far better preserved without those window fronts which appear utterly decorative.

01:21:55.362 -- - 01:21:58.702
[JOHN]: I blame the Pervy Patriarchy.

01:21:58.702 -- - 01:22:00.102
[JOHN]: Or maybe just Teng.

01:22:00.102 -- - 01:22:02.622
[JOHN]: Maybe Teng is the designer of this.

01:22:02.622 -- - 01:22:05.262
[JOHN]: He just wanted to look in.

01:22:05.262 -- - 01:22:07.762
[DEREK]: It could be the Pervy Yutani.

01:22:07.762 -- - 01:22:09.182
[DEREK]: They are well-known Yutani ships.

01:22:09.182 -- - 01:22:11.462
[DEREK]: Maybe she designed them all to be able to see inside.

01:22:11.462 -- - 01:22:12.242
[DEREK]: I would suspect.

01:22:12.242 -- - 01:22:14.042
[JOHN]: She must understand what they're doing.

01:22:14.562 -- - 01:22:16.942
[DEREK]: I would expect there is the visual element of it.

01:22:16.942 -- - 01:22:23.802
[DEREK]: You want to make sure you're able to see as much inside these cryopods because they are potentially keeping someone alive in there for 40 or 50 years.

01:22:23.922 -- - 01:22:26.862
[DEREK]: So you want to make sure that you have at least a visual confirmation.

01:22:26.862 -- - 01:22:27.742
[JOHN]: That they haven't died.

01:22:27.742 -- - 01:22:28.302
[DEREK]: They haven't died.

01:22:28.462 -- - 01:22:28.962
[JOHN]: That's true.

01:22:29.002 -- - 01:22:30.762
[DEREK]: But then there are very quick cursory.

01:22:30.762 -- - 01:22:30.962
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:22:30.962 -- - 01:22:32.202
[DEREK]: But the sensors may be wrong.

01:22:32.202 -- - 01:22:34.902
[DEREK]: You don't want to open up the pod if the sensors are wrong, right?

01:22:34.902 -- - 01:22:40.702
[DEREK]: You want to have a little visual view and make sure that person's alive, like Teng's doing every time he's walking past.

01:22:40.702 -- - 01:22:42.722
[DEREK]: I was just checking to see if she was breathing.

01:22:42.722 -- - 01:22:44.262
[DEREK]: I wasn't really perving on her, I promise.

01:22:44.262 -- - 01:22:45.442
[JOHN]: Well, yeah, exactly.

01:22:45.442 -- - 01:22:46.882
[JOHN]: And to your point, Dr.

01:22:46.882 -- - 01:22:55.442
[JOHN]: Bob, yes, the battle of Alien versus Octo Orb equally did not expect, but absolutely was thrilled by it.

01:22:55.442 -- - 01:22:56.122
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:22:56.122 -- - 01:22:56.642
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:22:56.642 -- - 01:22:57.262
[DEREK]: Thanks so much, Dr.

01:22:57.262 -- - 01:22:57.502
[DEREK]: Bob.

01:22:57.502 -- - 01:22:58.242
[JOHN]: Yeah, thanks, Dr.

01:22:58.242 -- - 01:22:58.862
[JOHN]: Bob.

01:22:58.862 -- - 01:23:06.742
[JOHN]: Also on Facebook, Joel Sharpton from the Articulate Coven podcast said, We knew Morrow had lost his daughter.

01:23:06.742 -- - 01:23:10.242
[JOHN]: She would have been an old woman when he returned at the very least.

01:23:10.242 -- - 01:23:19.362
[JOHN]: But to see he lost the very reason he had gone on the mission, giving her a good life one assumes makes him so much more sympathetic.

01:23:19.362 -- - 01:23:26.322
[JOHN]: I'd figured we'd get a backstory on the ship and crew eventually, but this was better than I had ever imagined.

01:23:26.322 -- - 01:23:26.962
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:23:26.962 -- - 01:23:28.342
[DEREK]: Yeah, thanks, Joel.

01:23:28.342 -- - 01:23:34.382
[DEREK]: Weirdly, I was actually going to talk about that when I said why I loved Babou Ceesay's performance in these scenes.

01:23:34.382 -- - 01:23:46.822
[DEREK]: You know, we saw moments with him with his young daughter on the beach in Thailand when he's telling her for the rest of your life effectively, look out into the stars and you will see me, I am out there.

01:23:46.822 -- - 01:23:54.862
[DEREK]: And then we see the note to him when he's reading all of the communicate that's been sent to him over his lifetime in cryo sleep while he's been away.

01:23:54.862 -- - 01:24:04.862
[DEREK]: And all of those stories, you know, we see the letters from his daughter, we see the letters from his wife, and then we see the confirmation that she's died in a fire in her home at 19 years old.

01:24:04.862 -- - 01:24:28.562
[DEREK]: Just the way that's all played and all played by Babou Ceesay, along with everything else that he's done in the episode itself, all of those things together just think are fantastically done, fantastically performed by the actor, and just give such an interesting rounding out of this character, who could easily just be, he's the bad guy from the start, who allowed all the humans to die, you know?

01:24:28.562 -- - 01:24:33.082
[DEREK]: There's so much more going on with the character, and delivered so well here.

01:24:33.082 -- - 01:24:33.602
[JOHN]: Good stuff.

01:24:33.602 -- - 01:24:34.422
[JOHN]: Thanks, Joel.

01:24:34.502 -- - 01:24:34.902
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:24:34.902 -- - 01:24:36.362
[DEREK]: Thanks, Joel.

01:24:36.362 -- - 01:24:39.142
[DEREK]: Paul Tenshi Lee sent in some feedback on this episode as well.

01:24:39.142 -- - 01:24:53.422
[DEREK]: He says, as Noah Hawley said in the official podcast, Episode 5 was his chance to make an Alien movie, and apparently it wasn't even going to be in the season at all, to the extent that Richa Moorjani hadn't been cast to play Zoya Zaveri when the first episode was being shot.

01:24:53.422 -- - 01:25:01.242
[DEREK]: This more in-depth view into Morrow, but also some of the other Maginot crew, really does pull Morrow slightly away from the full villain camp.

01:25:01.742 -- - 01:25:09.542
[DEREK]: Also, knowing that his daughter died 8 years into Maginot's mission makes his line to Yutani about all his family are gone to be so much more poignant.

01:25:09.542 -- - 01:25:14.162
[DEREK]: I will say again just how well the production design team reproduced the aesthetics of the Nostromo.

01:25:14.162 -- - 01:25:24.962
[DEREK]: I just watched a YouTube reaction of Alien by people new to the franchise, and I don't question at all that Nostromo and Maginot got outfitted by the same shipbuilding company, if not from the same shipyard.

01:25:24.962 -- - 01:25:31.642
[DEREK]: Finally, it is hardly surprising that we find Boy K to be the reason for Petrovich to sabotage the Maginot.

01:25:31.642 -- - 01:25:49.382
[DEREK]: The fact that they seem to have had a synchronous conversation suggests that there is faster than light communication in this universe, because I presume that the conversation happened around the time the Maginot was leaving Saturn and Petrovich programmed his cryopod to not let him go to sleep and put into the computer records that he went to sleep.

01:25:49.382 -- - 01:25:50.402
[DEREK]: Very good.

01:25:50.402 -- - 01:25:57.102
[DEREK]: We know from the first episodes that when they came out to cryo-sleep at Saturn, they knew about Prodigy because Shmuel was teaching Malachite about the Five.

01:25:57.422 -- - 01:26:04.482
[DEREK]: They could have been getting constant uptates via the Fast and the Light comms or got a news dump from the Well and Yutani stations around Saturn.

01:26:04.482 -- - 01:26:07.942
[DEREK]: I think they talked a little bit about some of those in ALIEN ROMBULOUS, didn't they?

01:26:07.942 -- - 01:26:13.082
[DEREK]: There are feeds that are sent out into the galaxy to the Well and Yutani planets as well.

01:26:13.082 -- - 01:26:19.262
[DEREK]: I don't know exactly how far those would be going, but I presume those would be sent out within the solar system at least.

01:26:19.262 -- - 01:26:23.742
[DEREK]: Once they get into the solar system, they get an update of what's going on on Earth and then they're able to read them.

01:26:23.982 -- - 01:26:28.062
[DEREK]: That's probably why they're able to get them when they get in around Saturn.

01:26:28.142 -- - 01:26:35.722
[DEREK]: That's again probably why Morrow is sitting down with all of these new communications that he may have missed over the last 10, 15 years of travel.

01:26:35.722 -- - 01:26:36.722
[JOHN]: Exactly.

01:26:36.722 -- - 01:26:43.502
[JOHN]: Of course, we don't really know when the communication between Boy Kavalier and Petrovich happened.

01:26:44.562 -- - 01:26:47.702
[JOHN]: Is it at the start of the 65 years?

01:26:48.982 -- - 01:26:49.482
[JOHN]: You don't know.

01:26:49.622 -- - 01:26:54.842
[JOHN]: I mean, he's wiped the comms and they've done a recovery on it.

01:26:54.842 -- - 01:27:00.842
[JOHN]: But equally, there's no real suggestion of when it may have happened.

01:27:00.842 -- - 01:27:06.302
[JOHN]: But equally, Boy Kavalier looks around the same age as he is now.

01:27:06.302 -- - 01:27:14.242
[JOHN]: So yeah, it could be as they come into the solar system that the comms are way faster.

01:27:14.482 -- - 01:27:27.602
[JOHN]: Because the other thing that we learn from that schooling of Malachite is that some of the planets are also owned by the companies as well, Mars, Saturn, and so on.

01:27:27.602 -- - 01:27:29.282
[DEREK]: That's right, yes, that's right.

01:27:29.282 -- - 01:27:33.242
[JOHN]: Yeah, they certainly probably got mobile masts all the way around.

01:27:33.242 -- - 01:27:34.042
[DEREK]: Of course they do.

01:27:34.042 -- - 01:27:35.602
[DEREK]: Yeah, without a doubt.

01:27:35.602 -- - 01:27:40.682
[DEREK]: If Richard Branson is getting it in space, Virgin Mobile is getting it out there too, without a doubt.

01:27:40.682 -- - 01:27:44.982
[JOHN]: Exactly, it's T-Mobile from Neptune or something like that.

01:27:44.982 -- - 01:27:48.442
[DEREK]: Virgin Mobile, come on, that's why Richard Branson is trying to get out there.

01:27:48.482 -- - 01:27:50.042
[DEREK]: Yeah, exactly.

01:27:50.042 -- - 01:27:51.342
[JOHN]: It's V.

01:27:51.342 -- - 01:27:55.102
[DEREK]: It will eventually be V-Mobile, I'm sure they won't be allowed to call it Virgin Mobile anymore.

01:27:55.102 -- - 01:27:56.522
[JOHN]: It will connect into the aliens.

01:27:56.522 -- - 01:27:57.362
[DEREK]: It will, it will.

01:27:57.802 -- - 01:27:58.942
[DEREK]: Yes.

01:27:58.942 -- - 01:28:03.342
[DEREK]: Paul continues, I am confused about who is supposed to be awake on the Maginot between Saturn and Earth.

01:28:03.342 -- - 01:28:10.662
[DEREK]: As near as I can tell, it was Captain Dinsdale, First Officer Zaveri, Science Officer Bronski, Biologist Chibuzi, Dr.

01:28:10.662 -- - 01:28:18.082
[DEREK]: Rahim Ensign slash Computer Systems Specialist Clem, Engineer Shmuel, Assistant and Engineer Malachite.

01:28:18.082 -- - 01:28:19.922
[DEREK]: Why wasn't Morrow awake?

01:28:19.922 -- - 01:28:25.762
[DEREK]: Given the absolute priority of the cargo, why wouldn't the security officer also stay awake for the final four months of the mission?

01:28:27.322 -- - 01:28:38.762
[DEREK]: Now, that's really well put together, Paul, but I just made the assumption that Clem was the acting security officer while Morrow was asleep.

01:28:38.762 -- - 01:28:46.482
[JOHN]: He wears the same ensign on his upper sleeve.

01:28:46.482 -- - 01:28:49.442
[JOHN]: So I think he is a security officer.

01:28:49.442 -- - 01:28:50.922
[DEREK]: Right.

01:28:50.922 -- - 01:28:55.162
[DEREK]: Maybe it's just because he just is barreling out information as Morrow comes out.

01:28:55.222 -- - 01:29:01.142
[DEREK]: It's like his update to his manager, who's been away on holidays for two weeks in that opening scene.

01:29:01.142 -- - 01:29:07.842
[DEREK]: And one of the things he says is that he knows that Zavari and Bronski are having a relationship and he's videoed it.

01:29:07.842 -- - 01:29:10.302
[DEREK]: He has footage if Morrow wants to see.

01:29:10.302 -- - 01:29:17.702
[DEREK]: And part of that, I thought, was that it was voyeuristic of him to be videoing two people having sex because he calls it vanilla sex anyway.

01:29:17.702 -- - 01:29:19.462
[DEREK]: But I have it if you want to see.

01:29:19.462 -- - 01:29:25.982
[DEREK]: But I wonder in retrospect, because Morrow then uses that against Zavari to get her back into line.

01:29:25.982 -- - 01:29:28.242
[DEREK]: I wonder if this was the security update.

01:29:28.242 -- - 01:29:30.942
[DEREK]: Hang on, boss, we have got a security issue.

01:29:30.942 -- - 01:29:33.482
[DEREK]: Two members of the team are now having sex.

01:29:33.482 -- - 01:29:38.782
[DEREK]: You need to know about this immediately after getting out of the pod before you even deal with the aliens on board.

01:29:38.782 -- - 01:29:41.102
[DEREK]: There's another security issue you want to know about.

01:29:41.102 -- - 01:29:44.462
[DEREK]: So that was my feeling that that's the reason why Morrow wasn't awake.

01:29:44.462 -- - 01:29:50.642
[DEREK]: And also, if Morrow is awake for the full 65 year mission, he'd be dead by the time they get back to Earth.

01:29:50.922 -- - 01:29:51.522
[JOHN]: I think that's it.

01:29:51.522 -- - 01:29:56.582
[JOHN]: I think ultimately what we've got is intergalactic shift work going on here.

01:29:56.582 -- - 01:30:03.362
[JOHN]: And I mean, that shift work possibly could be like a couple of years at a time.

01:30:03.362 -- - 01:30:04.042
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:30:04.042 -- - 01:30:07.162
[JOHN]: And I know what you're saying and why isn't he awake?

01:30:07.162 -- - 01:30:09.622
[JOHN]: But equally, there's a saboteur.

01:30:09.622 -- - 01:30:26.582
[JOHN]: So actually, it's Clem, even though we've been calling him the junior security officer, is when he is awake and Morrow isn't, he is the security officer for the ship.

01:30:26.582 -- - 01:30:28.102
[DEREK]: That's what I think so, yeah.

01:30:28.102 -- - 01:30:33.562
[JOHN]: And yes, then you have a debrief and a brief when they move back and forth.

01:30:33.562 -- - 01:30:36.462
[JOHN]: And so I guess that's it.

01:30:36.462 -- - 01:30:40.722
[JOHN]: And even with the captain and the medical officer.

01:30:40.722 -- - 01:30:48.242
[JOHN]: So you hear that Petrovich is Shmuel's equivalent as an engineer.

01:30:48.262 -- - 01:30:50.302
[JOHN]: Yeah, the engineering officer.

01:30:50.422 -- - 01:30:52.722
[JOHN]: And he should be asleep, but he's not.

01:30:52.722 -- - 01:30:53.382
[DEREK]: Yes, exactly.

01:30:53.382 -- - 01:31:00.022
[JOHN]: And so that thing in Episode 1 is where you have the crossover happening.

01:31:00.022 -- - 01:31:00.962
[DEREK]: Yes.

01:31:00.962 -- - 01:31:04.562
[DEREK]: And they all go back into cryosleep and he's being woken up at this point.

01:31:04.562 -- - 01:31:16.242
[DEREK]: And we did hear in Episode 1 when Morrow was going back into his cryosleep, we did hear him tell somebody, maybe it was Clem actually, I'll have to go back and watch, but I just didn't recognize him this time when we saw him.

01:31:16.322 -- - 01:31:25.362
[DEREK]: But he definitely tells someone, wake me up before everybody else when we're getting back into the space towards earth, wake me up before that.

01:31:25.362 -- - 01:31:31.362
[DEREK]: We thought that was him enacting his plan to crash the ship into Prodigy territory.

01:31:31.362 -- - 01:31:45.902
[DEREK]: But because he's the security officer and it was so important that the ship landed properly, he was effectively saying, wake me up early so that I can monitor the last couple of hours of the trip, rather than the last four months of the trip, or the last month, a couple of weeks, whatever it was that he was still asking for.

01:31:45.902 -- - 01:31:54.382
[JOHN]: He does say, wake me up before everybody else, because that's where I thought, oh, that's the reason for the sabotage.

01:31:54.382 -- - 01:31:55.462
[DEREK]: Yes.

01:31:55.462 -- - 01:31:55.922
[DEREK]: Exactly.

01:31:55.922 -- - 01:31:57.962
[DEREK]: But it turns out the sabotage was being done by somebody else.

01:31:57.962 -- - 01:31:58.842
[DEREK]: I think he was involved in that.

01:31:58.842 -- - 01:32:01.942
[DEREK]: I think he's just waking up the last couple of weeks rather than the last couple of months.

01:32:01.942 -- - 01:32:05.182
[DEREK]: So I think we've worked that one out there.

01:32:05.182 -- - 01:32:05.502
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:32:05.502 -- - 01:32:06.342
[JOHN]: Well, potentially.

01:32:06.342 -- - 01:32:06.622
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:32:06.842 -- - 01:32:10.682
[JOHN]: Hope you can see that line of thought there.

01:32:10.702 -- - 01:32:12.302
[DEREK]: Our rambling thoughts there, Paul.

01:32:13.262 -- - 01:32:17.722
[DEREK]: Finally, Paul says, I think Morrow must have more cyborg parts than his left arm.

01:32:17.722 -- - 01:32:22.742
[DEREK]: He opened the somewhat welded shut door to the bridge by pulling up with the mechanical arm.

01:32:22.742 -- - 01:32:30.302
[DEREK]: If that arm was grafted to regular bones, muscles, tendons and ligaments, the rest of his body would have been seriously injured during that action.

01:32:30.302 -- - 01:32:35.422
[DEREK]: That suggests that his bones and major muscles had to have been replaced by synthetic versions.

01:32:35.422 -- - 01:32:37.482
[JOHN]: That makes an awful lot of sense to me.

01:32:39.242 -- - 01:32:50.442
[JOHN]: Even the fact that he has a knife and a blowtorch up his arm, which means he's got some kind of gas canister somewhere, unless it's in both of his butt cheeks.

01:32:50.822 -- - 01:32:56.482
[JOHN]: Maybe he's more cyborg than we actually know.

01:32:56.622 -- - 01:33:10.902
[JOHN]: And certainly mainly because at the moment we haven't seen him naked or anything, so we don't know whether that kind of faded look of his cyborg arm is the same, say, down his left side.

01:33:10.902 -- - 01:33:15.462
[JOHN]: Maybe his palsy was affecting his left side.

01:33:15.462 -- - 01:33:18.602
[DEREK]: Oh, so the entire left side of his body, I get you, I get you, yeah.

01:33:18.602 -- - 01:33:24.642
[DEREK]: Yeah, like we know the arm is, he mentioned that he had a palsied arm, so we know that's a replacement.

01:33:24.642 -- - 01:33:34.862
[DEREK]: But remember, we also saw him attach connectors to his head and download all the information off the Maginot's computers when he was talking to Slykely that first time back in Episode 2, I think it was.

01:33:34.862 -- - 01:33:40.802
[DEREK]: So yes, there's definitely more enhancements to his body than just an arm.

01:33:40.802 -- - 01:33:44.522
[DEREK]: He's more, more machine than man now.

01:33:44.522 -- - 01:33:45.522
[DEREK]: Yes.

01:33:45.522 -- - 01:33:46.282
[DEREK]: Probably what you'd say.

01:33:46.282 -- - 01:33:48.082
[JOHN]: When is a machine, not a machine.

01:33:48.082 -- - 01:33:55.542
[JOHN]: Again, that conversation with Slykely might get a bit further elaborated on as well.

01:33:55.602 -- - 01:33:56.242
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:33:56.242 -- - 01:33:57.182
[DEREK]: Absolutely.

01:33:57.182 -- - 01:33:58.802
[DEREK]: That's it for the feedback for this week.

01:33:58.802 -- - 01:34:02.342
[DEREK]: Thanks so much to all of our wonderful listeners for all of your thoughts.

01:34:02.342 -- - 01:34:06.762
[DEREK]: You can email us to feedback at tvpodcastindustries.com if you have any thoughts on the episode so far.

01:34:06.762 -- - 01:34:09.602
[DEREK]: Or pop on over to our Facebook group at facebook.com/groups/tvpodcastindustries.

01:34:13.862 -- - 01:34:18.582
[DEREK]: And in there, the spoiler posts for each and every episode of the show as they're released next week.

01:34:18.582 -- - 01:34:21.622
[DEREK]: I think we're going to be following another 80s movie, John, are we?

01:34:21.622 -- - 01:34:23.022
[JOHN]: It sounds like it, doesn't it?

01:34:23.142 -- - 01:34:27.782
[JOHN]: Yes, it is Alien Earth Episode 6, The Fly.

01:34:28.802 -- - 01:34:33.642
[DEREK]: Someone's going to try and be transported and end up being merged with a fly.

01:34:33.642 -- - 01:34:38.222
[JOHN]: Well, wouldn't that be something even more horrific to see?

01:34:38.222 -- - 01:34:44.282
[DEREK]: Or is that a description of one of the other beasties that we haven't really spent any time with John?

01:34:44.282 -- - 01:34:49.922
[JOHN]: I've seen a few winged in some of the other containment cells there.

01:34:49.922 -- - 01:34:51.342
[JOHN]: We haven't actually seen them.

01:34:51.362 -- - 01:35:04.502
[JOHN]: It's not been one that's been featured, but other than through the misty glass, seeing what looks like insect wings beating.

01:35:04.502 -- - 01:35:05.162
[DEREK]: Yeah.

01:35:05.162 -- - 01:35:06.322
[DEREK]: There's five in total.

01:35:06.322 -- - 01:35:13.862
[DEREK]: I don't think they're including the egg, the facehugger, and the chest buster as three different creatures.

01:35:13.862 -- - 01:35:20.402
[DEREK]: We've seen the leeches, we've seen the xenomorphs as one species, we've seen the octi eye as well.

01:35:20.402 -- - 01:35:21.362
[JOHN]: We've seen the pod.

01:35:21.362 -- - 01:35:22.082
[DEREK]: We've seen the pod.

01:35:22.082 -- - 01:35:25.462
[DEREK]: So maybe the last one is the fly that we haven't seen yet.

01:35:25.462 -- - 01:35:26.262
[DEREK]: Oh, great fun.

01:35:26.262 -- - 01:35:29.222
[DEREK]: Can't wait to be terrified again next week.

01:35:29.222 -- - 01:35:30.602
[DEREK]: Thanks so much for joining us.

01:35:30.602 -- - 01:35:31.522
[DEREK]: Talk to you again next time.

01:35:31.522 -- - 01:35:34.742
[JOHN]: Yes, fellow Lost Boys, fellow aliens.

01:35:34.742 -- - 01:35:40.742
[JOHN]: As always, it is great discussing this space horror with you.

01:35:41.162 -- - 01:35:45.762
[JOHN]: Until next time, keep watching, keep listening and of course keep screaming.

01:35:45.762 -- - 01:35:46.522
[DEREK]: Bye.

01:35:46.522 -- - 01:35:46.662
[JOHN]: Bye.

01:36:18.294 -- - 01:36:28.774
[JOHN]: 17 days from Earth as it hurtles towards Earth as, as you say, invariably a spaceship to a missile to an arrow, according to Shmuel.

01:36:28.774 -- - 01:36:30.174
[DEREK]: Uh-huh.

01:36:30.174 -- - 01:36:31.034
[DEREK]: Shmuel.

01:36:31.034 -- - 01:36:33.954
[DEREK]: What's the name?

01:36:33.954 -- - 01:36:35.314
[DEREK]: Shmuel.

01:36:35.334 -- - 01:36:37.274
[JOHN]: Shmuel.

01:36:37.274 -- - 01:36:43.214
[DEREK]: It's written there as everybody dies, so it's in the synopsis, I think, it's S-C-H-M.

01:36:43.214 -- - 01:36:43.814
[DEREK]: Shmuel.

01:36:43.814 -- - 01:36:45.174
[DEREK]: Shmuel.

01:36:45.174 -- - 01:36:45.634
[DEREK]: Shmuel.